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Old 04-11-2014, 03:16 PM   #1
Sumta   Sumta is offline
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Inner barrels resolved

not my work, just posting here.

ORIGINAL

How to Increase the Range and Accuracy of Your Airsoft Gun


This is lengthy, yes, but it is a sum of information learned from nearly 20 years of airsoft experimentation and development that is invaluable to understanding how to get the most out of one's gun. This particular guide by joesig58 gives a good understanding of what it means to get better range and accuracy out of an airsoft gun. Read it and you may just learn something you didn't know!
*Note→you will see the word "consistent" or "consistency" often. In airsoft, this is a synonym for accurate and accuracy.
Commonly Mistaken Solutions
Most beginner airsofters or those of whom have been misinformed by retailers believe a tighter bore is better. This is not the case. The effectiveness of a barrel is determined by the bore tolerance (quality and consistency of the barrel). This means that a barrel will only truly increase performance by decreasing the amount of "imperfections" in the barrel. Top brands like PDI, Prometheus, Miracle, and Madbull have very smooth, straight, highly polished bores which give good results. The tightness of the barrel is simply a matter of what the user wants to do with it - use it in a CQB gun such as a pistol or small carbine, or in a DMR or sniper platform. This will be described more fully in the following sections.

What Does Bore Tightness Have to Do with Range and Accuracy?
A lot has to do with bore tightness. 6.01mm inner diameter barrels are not a good choice for long range engagements. This is because there is less space for the BB to ride on a "cushion of air" from the hop up. Barrels like Orga barrels and TK Twist barrels follow this principal - a wider bore = a more consistent hop. FPS will be lost, but this is why these barrels (Orga 6.23 mostly) are often used in Polar Star guns or upgraded AEGs and GBBRs. These guns will supply a large amount of air/gas to propel the BB out the full length of the barrel while giving an adequate amount of air underneath and on the sides of the BB for a perfect hop every time. For this reason, 6.03 barrels are suggested for AEGs that cannot supply a large amount of air without a bore-up kit. The Prometheus 6.03 barrel ($50-$80 depending on length) is an excellent choice for those who shoot full auto and engage enemies at short to medium ranges. For close range airsoft weapons (GBB pistols, AEPs, carbines, etc) the PDI 6.01 SUS304 barrel is the perfect choice. It beats all barrels in CQB accuracy. If you cannot afford these barrels, Madbull 6.01 or the PDI Raven barrels are a good economical choice and will be better than your stock barrel; not as good as the PDI SUS304 though. For long range engagements, the PDI 6.05 ($90-$160) has reigned supreme in this category. It provides the perfect balance for low air supplying AEGs or stock GBBRs, extreme quality bore, and space for a hop up "air cushion." If you want 250ft range and can supply the air, an Orga 6.23 barrel will give the best hop on the BB and have consistent backspin. It is difficult to supply enough air to get the full potential of this barrel with an AEG because of the piston-driven air system. Electro-pneumatic (Polar Star) or gas powered guns are better choices for this. If you can't decide and want a barrel that will adapt to any situation, a Miracle barrel is the best choice for those who cannot afford a PDI barrel and don't have the air supply for an Orga.
To sum this up:
  • Best CQB barrel: PDI 6.01 (Economical choice: Madbull 6.01, PDI Raven, or Angel Custom 6.01)
  • Best Mid-Range barrel: Prometheus 6.03 (Economical choice: Madbull 6.03 or Matrix 6.03)
  • Best Long Range barrel: PDI 6.05 or Orga 6.23 if enough air can be supplied (Economical choice: None, high performance = high cost)
  • Best All-Around-Purpose Barrel: Miracle barrels (Work well in AEG platforms)
  • Avoid stock barrels and cheap barrels (JBU, Classic Army, Matrix, storebrand barrels) and do not believe advertisements claiming a $40 barrel outperforms a $160 barrel - this is not true

Does Barrel Length Matter?
Yes, but to an extent. Many will think, with our basic understanding of physics as humans, that a longer barrel will "guide" the BB to its target much more consistently. This is not true. The more contact there is on the BB, the more its hop spin will be disrupted, creating inconsistency at long ranges past 50m. This is why 6.01 barrels show good accuracy at short ranges - the BB has no time to curve off-course. However, a BB cannot obtain enough spin from a 100mm barrel to travel 300m, no matter how good the hop up and barrel set up is. So, what length should one aim for? As a rule of thumb in the airsoft tech community, 455mm tends to be the most accurate length - the perfect balance between obtaining hop spin and "over" obtaining hop on the BB. If a barrel is longer, the BB will be in contact with the barrel longer, which can either disrupt the BBs initial backspin or cut off the air flow around the BB which would diminish the hop. 455mm tends to be the length at which the BB backspin "stabilizes" but does not lose its initial direction of backspin. In other words, each shot has the closest consistency in backspin as opposed to longer or shorter barrels. Does this mean a 300mm or 500mm barrel is less accurate? Slightly, but not enough to notice a large difference in game, especially before 70m so don't go putting a 455mm barrel in every one of your guns.
The main point is, a longer barrel does not mean longer range and accuracy. It just means your gun will be longer and, if it is a gas/spring powered gun, it will have slightly higher FPS. Longer barrel lengths will only increase FPS and decrease mobility and accuracy. If you own an AEG, you'll have to buy a new cylinder for that barrel length or bore-up kit because the piston being retracted in the gearbox may "suck" the BB just fired back into the barrel before it exits, creating a jam when firing full-auto on high RoF platforms. The gearbox will also not be able to supply an adequate amount of air for the increased volume of space from a longer barrel.
Avoid barrels longer than 500mm, as they just hurt accuracy and make carrying your gun an annoyance at times.

Does FPS = Range?
No. FPS will decrease the time it takes the BB to reach your target, and will likely cause your target more discomfort should you hit him or her. FPS does not increase your range in this aspect. However, it will allow you to use heavier BBs - which can travel a much longer distance when enough hop is applied. Using .30g - .43g BBs can vastly improve the performance of an airsoft gun at long ranges if the gun's hop up is able to put an effective backspin on the heavier BB. This is why snipers and DMRs tend to have higher power - to allow for the use of heavier BBs. 450-550fps will allow one to use .32g and heavier BBs which gives that player an advantage over those using .20g or .25g BBs in a 350fps AEG. These heavier BBs can push through air much more effectively, and will fly straighter at longer ranges. Yes, they fly slower, but the decrease in FPS is so subtle when compared to the range increase. Also, a heavier BB has more kinetic energy, meaning your target will feel the shot a bit more when hit. This helps snipers who use bolt action rifles because a player may not feel a single .20g BB hit them after it has traveled 50m or so because of the energy it has lost due to wind, brush, or other obstacles. A .43g BB however will maintain its velocity for much longer through wind and air and be felt much more clearly. So, in a sense, higher velocities allow one to increase his or her range by using heavier BBs with more hop on the BB, but alone it will not have much of an effect. After 350fps, range does not improve much until about 500fps. A 300fps gun will perform similarly to a 400fps gun if they have the same barrel and hop up setup.

Hop Up: The Key to Long Range Consistency
The Hop up unit is often overlooked by many, being over shadowed by the barrel or FPS from the power source (gearbox, spring, gas valve, etc.). Why are 250fps Tokyo Marui guns out-ranging 420fps JG guns? It is a matter of hop up. An upgrade to the hop up should be the priority of any experienced player when upgrading an airsoft gun. Depending on the gun's use, there are different applications of hop up. On snipers, it is absolutely vital and is the most important part of the airsoft sniper rifle one should focus on in order to utilize heavier BBs. On a CQB weapon or a sidearm like a GBB pistol however, not much is needed here. In both cases, however, a consistent hop is needed for accuracy.
SNIPERS: On sniper rifles, the hop up along with FPS will determine what BB the sniper will be able to utilize. A sniper wants the heaviest BB possible because it will keep its velocity and trajectory for the longest distance. As a general rule, most fields in the US have a bolt action sniper rifle FPS limit of 500fps or 550fps so most snipers aim for these benchmarks, depending on where they play. Once one achieves this FPS benchmark, it's time to select a hop up unit, bucking, and nub. For the standard spring rifles (APS - Type 96 and VSR are the most popular internal systems) the aftermarket PDI hop up units are the best choice. If one is looking for a cheaper option, the Angel Custom hop up units work well but are not as reliable as the design they copy. For gas sniper rifles, brands vary by the rifle type so I cannot recommend one single brand. Bolt action spring rifles are much more reliable and consistent than gas rifles, and have a wider variety of high quality aftermarket parts so it is suggested to upgrade a spring sniper instead.
AEGs: AEGs have a vast variety of aftermarket hop up units. For the common platforms, the Prowin hop up tends to be the best choice because of its robust build, steady hop up arm adjustment system, and air seal. It is very barrel friendly and works well with most brands (best with an Orga or PDI barrel). If you prefer the traditional hop up wheel and arm design, the Prometheus NEO Strike hop up is an excellent choice that is on par with the Prowin. Standard Tokyo Marui hop ups are also excellent if you cannot find a Prowin or Prometheus hop up unit for your airsoft gun. If this is not an option, Element makes good polymer hop up units. Yes they are plastic, but stack up to the top brands and compete very well. Still can't find one if you've got a non-traditional airsoft gun? Teflon tape mods and shimming your hop up wheels/arm is a good way to improve the performance of your hop up unit. If you have the tech skills, cutting slots for O-rings on the nozzle entry way and the feeding tube will increase air seal and feeding in your airsoft gun.
GAS RIFLES AND PISTOLS: There are heavy varieties of aftermarket parts for hop up units on GBBs and NBBs. PDI makes some parts for GBB pistols if you can find them for your model. For GBB pistol users, AIP and Nova Brass make good aftermarket hop ups if you are willing to do a little research. For GBBRs, Angry Gun and RA-Tech make exceptional parts that are affordable. If you cannot find these, Tokyo Marui hop up units are a good choice if you can get your hands on one. Internal accessories are limited for gas guns, so it is more common practice to do DIY mods like R-Hop and flat hop if you have the experience. However most come with well put-together hop ups, especially KWA GBBs and Tokyo Marui.
So now that you've found a hop up, we need to choose a nub. This is the piece that pushes down on the hop up bucking, creating the hop.There are several good options for this. The first I will discuss is R-hop. R-hop is a small piece of rubber-like material that is installed into the hop up window on the barrel. This is only for very experienced technicians and hobbyists because of the vast amount of tuning and testing that needs to be done. A nub needs to be cut, the hop up arm modified, and the patch must be cut and sanded perfectly. If it is done correctly though, the results are amazing. 250-300ft ranges can be achieved with an R-hop along with a high quality barrel, hop up unit, bucking, and heavy weight high quality BB. If you feel confident enough to try it, buy a cheap Matrix barrel and do some research on how to install it and what you'll need before you try to install an R-hop on your PDI or Prometheus barrel. IR-Hop is a better choice for those who play in colder climates, as the standard R-hop patch does not perform as well in cold weather. If you're not an experience tech but still have some know-how, a flat hop may be a good choice. Orga barrels come pre-cut to utilize one of these should you choose to. If not, you will have to shave everything off the inside of your bucking. There are videos on youtube of how to do this. Flat hop isn't as good as R-hop, but it comes close. There are specialized nubs for flat hops, such as the Namazu nub that can be used instead of modifying your stock nub and hop up arm. If none of these are available, an H-nub or Concave spacer will do. If you do not feel confident to install these (as it is somewhat tricky on some hop up units) then a standard nub will do for now.
Now let's look at buckings. If you are installing an R-hop or flat hop, the Prometheus bucking is a good choice. If you are on a budget, the Lonex 70į bucking is excellent and performs just as well for less than half the price. If you are unable to find the Lonex, look at Maple Leaf or Systema buckings. If you are just using the standard nub and bucking combination without modification, the PDI "W" hold is a good choice for accurate hop. Another good choice is the REAPS A+ bucking. This bucking is ideal for guns that shoot full auto as it increases your range but will slightly decrease accuracy. If tuned, however, the REAPS bucking works very well. The Madbull "Shark" buckings and Angel Custom buckings are average and will do for the player who is not very experienced with modifying internal parts as they are better than a standard bucking.

BB Weight, Size, and Brand
There is an overwhelming combination of BBs in the airsoft market. Every airsofterís goal, no matter what gun they use, should be to find the perfect BB weight and size. For those with 8mm guns, there is not much choice and usually these guns are shotguns, so accuracy does not matter much. As for the 6mm BB, there are several brands that one should try to stick to. For those who use 6.01 diameter barrels, KWA guns, and KSC guns, you may want to utilize KWA and KSC BBs because they are 5.88mm in diameter. They work very well with 6.02 and tighter barrel bores and have an excellent polish, quality control, outer shape consistency, and weight consistency. The variety of weight however is limited. For those that use 6.03 and wider, the standard 5.95mm BB is a good choice. These include Maruzen, Bioval, Madbull, WE-Tech, Maxi, G&G, Elite Force, Goldenball, King Arms, Excel, and Airsoft Elite. The best of the bunch are Maruzen, Biovall, Goldenball, and Madbull in that order. It all depends on your gun though. The gunís FPS, barrel diameter, hop up strength, air output (not FPS, volume of air), and firing mode (full-auto, semi, or bolt action) all determine together what BB works best. Without doing advanced math calculations to see what BB will fly the furthest based on results form more advanced math from your air volume and barrel diameter/length, it is best to buy small amounts of several brands you can afford and try them out. It is cheapest to select your BB based on your gun rather than your gun based on your BB, so have fun with it. Load several mags with different BBs (careful not to mix anything) and see how your groupings are and what range your hop up will flatten the BB out to. Donít know what weight to buy? Go by this chart. (itís not exact, but is good for reference is an excellent way to estimate your results):
  • 280-300FPS: No heavier than .20g; however if your hop up is better than average, shoot for .23g.
  • 300-350FPS: .25g if your hop up can handle it is a good way to go. .20g still works well here and is appropriate, but try a little heavier like .23g or .25g.
  • 350-400FPS: With this velocity, aim for .25g up to .30g depending on your hop up set up. Properly tuned rifles with this BB weight will outperform those with lighter BBs at range.
  • 400-450FPS: Going for a DMR set up? Try at least .28g and with proper hop up adjustment, .36g is achievable with exceptional results.
  • 500-550FPS: Long range marksmanship requires the heaviest and best BB you can afford. .32g up to .43g is suggested for those who want that "whistle" sound when a heavy BB with good backspin penetrates the air on its way to the doomed target. A patient, meticulous technician and shooter should be able to achieve 250-300ft range with his or her rifle.
  • 600FPS or more: You're going to hurt someone. Good luck finding a field that will allow this. If you and some buddies do this in a private game, wear some full face protection and a cup so you do not end up ugly and childless.

Power Systems
There are several types of ways to power an airsoft gun: battery, gas, HPA, and spring. Each has its advantages and disadvantages, so let's examine them if you don't already know.
  • Battery: Electric guns (AEGs and AEPs) are, when properly air sealed, very consistent. Consistency = accuracy. These guns are good for close to medium range combat, as they can put out full auto fire for extended periods because of generally high magazine capacity. Accuracy wise, AEGs are very consistent within the range they operate in (30-60m). This is the primary choice for general field purpose. If heavy upgrades are applied (R-hop/flat hop, PDI barrel, heavy BB, high quality hop up unit and consistent FPS), ranges of 250ft have been seen. This is extreme however, and require hundreds of dollars and dozens of labor hours to achieve.
  • Gas: Gas powered guns are either GBB or NBB (gas blowback or non-blowback). Because of the high volume of gas putout (CO2, green gas, propane, red gas) these guns have an advantage over AEGs and can utilize heavier BBs, get more backspin on a BB with less hop, and use wider bore barrels like Orga barrels. However, gas is not very consistent in FPS output, magazine capacity is limited, and aftermarket parts are limited. The heavy vibrations in the gun from recoil can affect barrel performance, and gas being spit into the barrel on every shot can cause jams or decreased performance if not cleaned often enough. Gas shotguns are a good choice for CQC players as the cons discussed above do not apply much. Gas guns also feature extremely realistic operation which attracts many players. GBB pistols are the primary choice for a sidearm as it allows high power in a small platform.
  • HPA: HPA powered airsoft guns are called Electro-pneumatic rifles. The most popular of these is the Polar Star series of rifles. These use High Pressure Air that comes from an air tank with maintained air pressure like a paintball gun. This system is superior to AEGs in that air supply can easily be adjusted via the FCU (Fire Control Unit) that is powered by a small battery hidden inside the gun. Polar stars more easily adapt to Orga barrels and longer barrels without modification. They can also fire in closed bolt mode, like a real rifle (a round is chambered, then fired, rather than on an AEG where the round is fired as it is chambered) which gives better consistency because of consistent BB placement in the hop up chamber. Polar stars have a feature which allows the user to adjust the time allowed between rounds loaded, which can lead to perfect feeding and firing consistency. Gas guns can be converted to HPA, and this is a good way to achieve excellent consistency with a gas powered sniper rifle. Daytona guns are blowback guns powered by HPA, but do not offer an FCU like the Polar Star. Although expensive (a Polar Star gearbox alone is $500, not including an air tank or regulator line), it is a proven superior system to all others.
  • Spring: Bolt action sniper rifles and shotguns fall into this category. Spring snipers have been seen as the pinnacle of accuracy and range in airsoft. With velocities in excess of 500FPS, these guns can utilize the heaviest BBs available and make it easier to put backspin on BBs such as .43g. These guns feature the closed bolt method of loading, in which a BB is chambered, held in place, then fired. This gives better consistency. A spring also gives excellent consistency, varying by only 5FPS per shot at the most if it is a quality spring. There are also many upgrades by reputable brands to give the best possible performance at long range shooting, particularly for the Type 96 and VSR-10 platforms. M24 and M28 models are also popular and compatible with APS/VSR parts in most cases. For these reasons, the spring powered long rifle is the top choice for long range shooters and snipers. However, high performance = high cost and labor, as a 100m maximum range build can cost in excess of $500 to build.
Things We Sometimes Overlook
  • Zero your sight(s)! Using sights that do not tell you where your shots are actually going to hit never helped anyone! Use a cheap bore-sighter or look up videos on youtube if you are unsure of how to zero your iron sights, red dot, or scope.
  • Make sure your barrel is locked into place! Too often does an inner barrel wobble inside the outer barrel with the user unaware of this accuracy handicap. Make some improvised barrel spacers and/or shim the muzzle of your inner barrel (put small folded pieces of paper between the inner barrel and the end of the outer barrel to keep the inner barrel from moving). Make sure the barrel sits properly in your hop up (does not slide in and out easily and does not rotate at all - use teflon tape to wrap around the inner barrel under the bucking and on top of the bucking to stop this).
  • Clean your barrel and hop up nub (the part that touches the BB inside the hop up window) regularly! If it is a tightbore barrel, cleaning should be done after every skirmish. If the weather is rainy, environment dusty or dirty, be sure to clean your barrel before storing your gun. Also, do NOT spray excessive amounts of Silicone into your hop up, this oil is prone to collecting dirt and dust if left to sit for a few weeks.
  • Shim everything you can! Your hop up arm so there is no side-to-side play, your hop up wheels so they do not turn while firing, your hop up unit so it does not vibrate... the list goes on. If you have the experience, take these measures before going out on the field again.
There you have it. I believe I covered everything. Remember now - this is airsoft. Range and accuracy is very limited. Do not expect to hit a stationary, man-sized target more than 30% of the time at 100m if your gun is able to even reach that mark. You can get there, though, by investing in quality parts and doing the little things like shimming your hop up. A lot of little adds up to a lot more than little. Take what you've learned here and do a little more research if you have questions still. The forums are good places to look as people share their results with any set up or part you can imagine. Also, message me, as I have a good amount of playing and tech-ing experience in regards to most airsoft equipment and methods.
Thank you for reading!
- By: joesig58
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Last edited by Sumta; 04-20-2014 at 03:27 PM.
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Old 04-11-2014, 03:18 PM   #2
Sumta   Sumta is offline
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ARMS October Custom Inner Barrel testing - Imgur

Tokyo Marui Standard Barrel (363mm)


Normal Barrel data: Velocity: (m/s) 1st round: 93.9 2nd: 92.4 3rd: 92.0 4th: 92.4 5th: 94.3 Average velocity: 93.0 m/s (.86J) 20 meter grouping: 72mm 30 meter accuracy: 8/10 hits

ORGA Airsoft Magnus HD Barrel (363mm)


ORGA airsoft Magnus HD barrel (363mm) The successor the the previously released and highly praised 6.23mm Magnus barrel. This variation, the Magnus HD, reduces the diameter to 6.13mm to prevent a large loss of velocity as was common with the 6.23mm model. The inner barrel surface is coated with teflon to minimize the impact on BBs that contact the barrel surface. As with all ORGA barrels, a flat hop is recommended. Data: MSRP: 7,480 yen Velocity: (m/s) 1st round: 92.6 2nd: 93.7 3rd: 92.2 4th: 92.0 5th: 93.7 Average velocity: 92.8 m/s (.86J) 20 meter grouping: 70mm 30 meter accuracy: 8/10 hits

ORGA Airsoft Magnus HD Barrel (363mm)


The extremely well machined chamber end of the barrel is thought to help the hop up achieve the maximum effect, and is a favored point of this barrel with users.

Tanio Koba Hop Twist Barrel


Tanio Koba Hop Twist barrel Unlike real firearms, where the bullet meshes with the rifling, the rifling in the Tanio Koba barrel is designed to guide the escaping air around the BB and keep it from contacting the sides of the barrel. Air leaks with this barrel are thought to heavily impact the velocity, which is a major difference from standard barrels. The grouping is extremely tight, and this is primarily to the hop being adjusted well. If the hop is too weak, the airflow can pull on the BB, and if the hop is too strong, BBs have a pronounced tendency to fly up and left. With a well-adjusted hop, this barrel gives excellent grouping and accuracy results. Data: MSRP: 6,090 yen Velocity: (m/s) 1st round: 90.8 2nd: 90.2 3rd: 90.2 4th: 91.5 5th: 91.4 Average velocity: 90.8 m/s (.82J) 20 meter grouping: 55mm 30 meter accuracy: 5/10 hits

Tanio Koba Hop Twist Barrel


Looking past the moderate crown, down the muzzle of the barrel, the rifling is readily aparrent, and it almost appears to be a real rifle barrel.

PDI 05 Inner Barrel (375mm)


PDI 05 Inner Barrel (375mm) Manufactured out of Japanese stainless steel, as the name suggests, the 05 Inner Barrel has a internal diameter of 6.05mm, which though it is only slightly tighter than a standard barrel, lead to a considerable increase in velocity. The grouping was also a bit tighter than that of a standard barrel. The results of the 30m plate were a bit disappointing, as it missed one shot more than the normal barrel, though it is possible there was a measurement error of some type. The silver color or stainless steel construction gives an impression of very high performance, and the many available barrel lengths and types offered by PDI are also a strong point of this barrel series. Date: MSRP: 6,593 yen Velocity: (m/s) 1st round: 95.8 2nd: 94.3 3rd: 95.4 4th: 95.4 5th: 94.2 Average velocity: 95.1 m/s (.90J) 20 meter grouping: 72mm 30 meter accuracy: 7/10 hits

PDI 08 Inner Barrel (375mm)


PDI 08 inner barrel Another stainless steel barrel manufactured by PDI, offered in the same diameter as normal barrels, 6.08mm. However, though the diameter should be identical, there was an increase in velocity. This could be due to to the barrel material causing BBs less friction as they contact the barrel. (Ed note: or reduced vibration.) The grouping was slightly looser then the 05 barrel, but the metal plate accuracy fell considerably. The stainless construction of this barrel is a strong advantage, however, and would be well suited for additional velocity and airflow tuning. The 08 is also a very attractive silver barrel, and comes in most of the same variations and lengths as the 05 barrel series. There are a number of variations suited for imported guns as well. Data: Price: 7,875 yen Velocity: (m/s) 1st Round: 94.0 2nd: 95.1 3rd: 95.9 4th: 94.0 5th: 95.8 Average velocity: 95.0m/s (.90J) 20 meter grouping: 75mm 30 meter accuracy: 4/10 hits

PDI 01 Inner Barrel (375mm)


PDI 01 inner barrel (375mm) Another PDI barrel, this time an extremely tight barrel. As the diameter (6.01mm) is very tight, a considerable velocity increase was observed, and impressive results were observed on the grouping at 20 meters. However, the results of only 5 hits on the 30 meter plate were not favorable results for this barrel. There was the impression the shots went wild at the end of their flight path. Though this trend is often observed with loose barrels, it also presented itself here with a super tight barrel. Because the barrel is so tight, there may be a lot of problems caused by poor BB tolerances. It is very difficult to visually distinguish from 05 and 08 barrels, but all of the models seem to be extremely well made. It may be our imagination, but the crowning of the barrel seems to be the deepest of the various models. Data: Price: 8,925 yen Velocity: (m/s) 1st Round: 96.0 2nd: 95.9 3rd: 95.9 4th: 95.7 5th: 96.0 Average velocity: 95.9 m/s (.92J) 20 meter grouping: 67mm 30 meter accuracy: 5/10 hits

PDI Raven01+ Inner Barrel (375mm)


PDI Raven 01+ Inner Barrel (375mm) The blacked out, reasonably priced PDI variation. Despite this, there was a considerable increase in velocity, and achieved impossibly good results on the 20 meter grouping, and indredibly, had perfect accuracy on the 30 meter plate. The flight path of the BBs at the end of their trajectory was quite excellent, and gave a good impression overall. As with all PDI barrels, this barrel is also offered in a large number of variations and lengths, and is not limited to exclusively AEGs. Compared to other PDI models, the raven barrel is a attractive black color, leading to the name 'Raven'. Even though it's a 6.01mm barrel, the cost performance is excellent. Data: Price: 2,912 yen Velocity: (m/s) 1st Round: 95.9 2nd: 96.3 3rd: 97.6 4th: 97.4 5th: 95.3 Average velocity: 96.5m/s (.93J) 20 meter grouping: 58mm 30 meter accuracy: 10/10 hits

Laylax Prometheus EG Barrel (363mm)


DescriptionLaylax Prometheus EG barrel (363mm) Made from the same stainless steel as many other manufacturers, this barrel has an inner diameter of 6.03mm. However, unlike many other manufacturers, the EG barrel does not utilize an inner coating to increas accuracy, but instead uses very high quality stainless steel and high tolerances. In the velocity data, a drop in velocity was observed, and some slightly loose flyers were observed. This is likely not a fault of the barrel itself, but a common result with tight barrels. Data: Price: 6,090 yen Velocity: (m/s) 1st Round: 91.3 2nd: 91.3 3rd: 91.9 4th: 91.9 5th: 91.3 Average velocity: 91.5 m/s (.84J) 20 meter grouping: 60mm 30 meter accuracy: 8/10 hits

Laylax Prometheus EG Barrel (363mm)


The EG barrel strongly resembles a normal barrel, but the muzzle is more steeply crowned, which should result in more accurate results, and this barrel is extremely durable.

KM Project TN Perfect Barrel (365mm)


KM Project TN Perfect Barrel (365mm) Long a maker of custom barrels, the perfect barrel has been used by many users for many years. The inner surface is teflon coated, and has a diameter of 6.04mm, which is slightly more efficient than normal barrels, which leads to an increase in velocity. The grouping was basically average, and the results on the metal plate were not too poor either. The strongest point of this barrel was the extremely consistent velocity results, and is a strong advantage of the teflon coated barrel. Data: Price: 5,565 yen Velocity: (m/s) 1st Round: 95.0 2nd: 94.8 3rd: 94.9 4th: 95.0 5th: 95.8 Average velocity: 91.5 m/s (.90J) 20 meter grouping: 75mm 30 meter accuracy: 6/10 hits

KM Project TN Perfect Barrel (365mm)


The grey color of the TN barrel is a particularly notable point, and there are many length variations available. The hop window is also a very strong point with this barrel as well, and the muzzle clearly defines it as a custom barrel.

KM Project Large Bore TN Barrel (365 mm)


DescriptionKM Project Large Bore TN Perfect barrel (Total length 365mm, 65mm extension pipe) The latest barrel released by KM head is a large bore barrel (Ed note: 6.06mm.), and the one we are using has a 365 mm overall length, but is actually composed of a 300mm base barrel and a 65mm extension tube. KM project is thought to be trying to get TN barrel performance out of the 300mm section, while the extension tube functions as a loose barrel. With this effect, the grouping was quite good, and 8 hits were made on the metal plate. Data: Price: 6,300 yen Velocity: (m/s) 1st Round: 95.1 2nd: 94.9 3rd: 95.1 4th: 95.1 5th: 95.8 Average velocity: 95.2 m/s (.91J) 20 meter grouping: 62mm 30 meter accuracy: 8/10 hits

KM Project Large Bore TN Barrel (365 mm)


DescriptionLooking at the muzzle it does not seem to be a barrel that would use normal BBs, but this is the intention of the extension tube. The actual barrel ends 65mm from the end of the muzzle, in this case, with results you can easily experience yourself.
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Old 04-11-2014, 03:42 PM   #3
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Very informative, thank you Sumta for this post. I use much of the info I find in here (gonna take a bit). +1 for this post
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Old 04-11-2014, 03:53 PM   #4
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JUST ONE BIT I WILL ADD AS I WAS RE-REVIEWING IT.

the pdi raven .01 have the highest hit rate, but it's coated stainless steel. the awesome accuracy comes with the limit of how long that coating lasts.
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Old 04-18-2014, 11:14 PM   #5
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Nice to see you posted that guide I wrote on my Ebay account. ;) Glad to see you found it informative! I wrote that because I was angry with retailers selling 6.01 tightbores as if they were the perfect solution to range and accuracy.

The other test is quite informative too, thank you!
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Old 04-19-2014, 01:25 AM   #6
Sumta   Sumta is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joesig58 View Post
Nice to see you posted that guide I wrote on my Ebay account. ;) Glad to see you found it informative! I wrote that because I was angry with retailers selling 6.01 tightbores as if they were the perfect solution to range and accuracy.

The other test is quite informative too, thank you!
Hehe. I got tired of people always asking here and wanted to knowbif anyone did a orga and tk twist side by side.

For both of those :)

Glad to have you here (good to see sighting the source paid off)
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How to wash your BB's
A&K SVD vs King Arms SVD
Inner barrel

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"Vika" PenDragon Inc. VSS 370fps
"M.C." A&K SR-25 360FPS
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Old 04-19-2014, 04:50 AM   #7
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Awsome post, thanks alot.
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Old 04-19-2014, 03:10 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumta View Post
Hehe. I got tired of people always asking here and wanted to knowbif anyone did a orga and tk twist side by side.

For both of those :)

Glad to have you here (good to see sighting the source paid off)
Thanks man! I love the Orga 6.23. My Polar Star gets 200ft effective range with a 300mm barrel and flat hop at 400fps +/-2fps. I use Elite Force .28g bbs with that setup (MK18). The MK12 setup has about the same effective range but with Semi-Auto at 450fps and .40g WE bbs. Can't wait to see what an R-hop does! I'll post a thread about all my experimentation sometime.

I also wanna try that Prometheus Delta Strike (I think that is what it's called). Anyone use that barrel with notable success?
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Old 04-19-2014, 04:17 PM   #9
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Great write-up (I have not read all of it yet but from what I see it looks good).
One thing I did note is that you say that the PDI hopups are good. I don't know if you have ever owned one but they are not that great. I have owned 2 of them and I got rid of them both. I now recommend that people don't waste their money on one.
They are hard to make accurate (they can be made accurate though) and they also loose FPS because they use AEG buckings. If they stuck with normal VSR or L96 buckings (These designs are better than the AEG bucking design) then the hopup chamber would have been better than a standard chamber.
I would suggest you edit that part out. :) Cheers

Also people can use an extra long barrel to make their gun more accurate but it will need a little downward curve (from a long range barrel mod) to make the bb travel along the top of the inner barrel. This will mean the bb will exit the barrel at the same point each time. So you can get excellent accuracy and more FPS with a long inner barrel but you will need the LRB mod.

Another thing is I found the Reaps bucking to be good but the Maple bucking is better. The nub is designed slightly better.

One thing I wonder about barrels with rifling is, how do you clean them? I would think that you would leave little pieces of cloth in the rifling.
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Old 04-19-2014, 05:51 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1tonne View Post
One thing I wonder about barrels with rifling is, how do you clean them? I would think that you would leave little pieces of cloth in the rifling.
I used a Tanio Koba ages ago in a VSR, never had issues with cloth getting stuck. The lands are very smooth, so a bit of rubbing alcohol went a long way to clean everything up between game days.
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Old 04-20-2014, 01:15 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1tonne View Post
Great write-up (I have not read all of it yet but from what I see it looks good).
One thing I did note is that you say that the PDI hopups are good. I don't know if you have ever owned one but they are not that great. I have owned 2 of them and I got rid of them both. I now recommend that people don't waste their money on one.
They are hard to make accurate (they can be made accurate though) and they also loose FPS because they use AEG buckings. If they stuck with normal VSR or L96 buckings (These designs are better than the AEG bucking design) then the hopup chamber would have been better than a standard chamber.
I would suggest you edit that part out. :) Cheers

Also people can use an extra long barrel to make their gun more accurate but it will need a little downward curve (from a long range barrel mod) to make the bb travel along the top of the inner barrel. This will mean the bb will exit the barrel at the same point each time. So you can get excellent accuracy and more FPS with a long inner barrel but you will need the LRB mod.

Another thing is I found the Reaps bucking to be good but the Maple bucking is better. The nub is designed slightly better.

One thing I wonder about barrels with rifling is, how do you clean them? I would think that you would leave little pieces of cloth in the rifling.
I had good experiences with PDI hop ups, but I've only used ones for the SW M24. I can't say anything about the APS and VSR ones, so I'll take your advice and edit that lol. And with the LRB mod I decided not to discuss that - as it is a little more advanced and I have not performed the mod yet, so I decided not to speak on it.

Thanks for your advice! And as for cleaning the rifled barrels, I think a more rigid material like a piece from a bedsheet or tarp would work nicely. The surface is smooth and doesn't give off lint like cotton or polyester can if ripped.
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Old 04-23-2014, 04:57 AM   #12
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It is recomended to use PDI 6.05 or Orga 6.23 for long range shooting.
But what about new PDI 6.08?
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Old 04-23-2014, 06:05 AM   #13
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I have said this before but the pdi hop is impractical. Yes it's better for aps2 and ca m24 platforms but the tm precision chamber for vsr-10 will outperform it and is easier to adjust on the feild.


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Old 04-23-2014, 01:39 PM   #14
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What bb's did you use for this test?
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Old 04-23-2014, 09:13 PM   #15
Sumta   Sumta is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STOCK_SOHC_DX View Post
What bb's did you use for this test?

good to know you followed what was posted :D

" The BBs used are G&G .20 BIO BBs."
from the link to the original.

for any others unable to check

ARMS October Custom Inner Barrel testing

AEG Custom Inner Barrel Testing As one of the principally used upgrade parts, inner barrels are used to increase velocity and influence the BBs final flight path. Currently, both tight and loose barrel options exist when used to tune consistency and airflow. The recently developed loose barrels use the air released at the time of firing to stabilize the round and keep contact between the BB and barrel to a minimum, which have their roots in the Hop Twist barrel developed by Tanio Koba. Utilizing rifled channels cut into the barrel to guide the airflow down the barrel to a high degree of precision, this results in some of the best results among many of the commercially available loose barrels. Conversely, there also exist tight bore barrels that minimize the contact with the inner barrel by adding velocity to the BB. KM head has also produced a barrel that fits into both categories, however there are many factors in installing this barrel that we were not able to replicate for the sake of the test. Inner barrel testing process: The gun used is a TM Recoil Shock M4A1 Carbine. The barrel length is the stock M4 carbine length, or as close as possible The BBs used are G&G .20 BIO BBs. A short zoom scope was used to help minimize the human factor. A standard Marui hop was used. The hop was first adjusted to zero the scope, and when barrels were changed, the hop was adjusted to meet the zero on the scope, without changing any elevation settings on the scope itself. Velocity was measured after the hop setting was completed on each barrel. The targets were a paper target at 20 meters, and a 20cm diameter metal plate at 30 meters. The groupings were measured on the paper target, and the metal plate was used to record the number of positive hits, and 10 rounds were fired at each distance.
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