|07-31-2018, 04:39 AM||#1|
Join Date: Oct 2016
Novritsch SSG24 vs Modify Mod24 - Differences - Comparison - Review
Modify Mod24 vs NOVRITSCH SSG24 Comparison
There is a huge battle going on between SSG24 ďFanboysĒ and people who say ďa SSG24 is simply a Modify M24Ē. Novritsch told us, that he improved the Modify M24, BUTÖ is this really true? Surprisingly nobody managed to get a Modify M24 and a SSG24 to just compare these two in detail.
So I did it! And I want to share the results with the whole airsoft community. I purchased my Modify Mod24 last week, so I it should be one of the newest batches.
First of all I have to mention that this review is going to be very detailed. So if you arenít interested so much in details and just want to know the conclusion, just scroll down to the hard facts and read it.
The black rifle on the top is my NOVRITSCH SSG24 from batch#2. The outer barrel is changed to the short one. Everything else else is still bone stock. It shots around 15.000 shots till now.
You can see that the shape of the whole gun is pretty much the same on both. The barrels look different - more details about the barrels will come later down below.
First of all, before disassembling the guns, I checked if there is a difference if you look at and hold the gun. Unfortunately the outer barrel of my Mod24 was wobbling quite a bit. Compared to the SSG, the outer barrel of the SSG is really sitting there like a boss and there is no space for wobbling. So thatís one point for the SSG. Later after disassembling I experienced why the outer barrel isnít wobbling around. More details later.
Otherwise, except the Novyboy Logo on the back plate and receiver and the different scoperail, I didnít find anything remarkable.
So I started with disassembling both guns step by step.
Novritsch said that the stock of the SSG is a glass fiber reinforced polymer, like the real M24 stock. I never held a real M24 Stock in my hands, so I canít confirm if that is true, but something that I can clearly confirm is that the SSG stock is pretty much the same like the Modify Stock.
I recognized that the MOD24 length to pull adjustment is rattling and wobbling quite a bit, while the SSG24 one was nice and tight. After I looked closer I saw that the SSG24 has an O-ring between the disk and the stock.
A very simple and cheap solution to the annoying typical M24 problem - I give you that one Novritsch.
What I also recognized is that the front bipod studs are different. The bipod stud of the SSG is narrower than the Mod24 stud. Itís the exact same size as the one of my VSR-10. Maybe it is compatible with more bipods?
So all I can say: the stocks are made of the same material and there are some tiny improvements at the SSG stock.
The receivers of these two rifles are completely identical. The only difference between those is the picatinny rail and the glide rings.
The rail of the SSG looks very cool honestly, but the customer hasnít that much mounting possibilities like on the rail of the Mod24 sine the SSG24 cutout is quite long. Personally Iím cool with both options.
The gliderings of the SSG24 are 0.7mm tighter than the one of the Mod24. This will not affect the performance but it just feels more snug when cocking the SSG24.
Top one is SSG. Bottom is Mod24
After I went further on, I found out that the Magwell of Mod24 doesnít have the small hole in it. Just like on my VSR-10 this hole helps getting BBs out of the gun in case they got back into the cylinder area. Just pull back the cylinder, take out the Magazine and let the BBs fall out. Thatís a small improvement, but this actually doesnít make the gun shoot better.
The Outer Barrel is a huge topic in this case. It is the biggest visible difference between these two rifles. Just to start simple: the SSG has a bull Barrel ó the Mod24 doesnít. Apart from the fact, that the outer barrel of the SSG has grooves, which makes the gun really look cool, there are additionally some nice features.
First of all, the Bull barrel has a huge advantage. It is more difficult to bend in case you fall down on your gun or something. So in my opinion thatís a huge improvement for a gun. But this is not the only detail.
After comparing both outer barrels with each other I found some other significant details.
You can see that the outer barrel of the SSG has this cutout, similar to a keymod one. The bipod stud connects to it. This way there is no wobbling. Thatís the huge difference between these guns and itís something I would love my VSR-10 to have. Three connections points are just better than the usual two.
As I already mentioned at the beginning, the Mod24 outer barrel is wobbling around too much. Thatís the reason why there is no wobbling around at the SSG24. This is a solid improvement.
The SSG24 comes with a barrel spacer which the mod24 doesnít. Also the SSG24 outer barrel endcap has an o-ring insert which the mod24 doesnít. Thatís a big plus point and will help a lot with the consistency.
As you can also see the color and also the shape of the shell material is slightly different. The Mod24 is advertised to handle a M150 while the SSG24 can handle a M190. Maybe the shell is of a better material?
What I also noticed immediately is that the second safety is removed on the SSG24. This means that you can shoot with the bolt up. I removed it on my VSR-10 too since it annoyed me while playing. But Iím not sure if everybody will like this change.
After disassembling the trigger unit I tried to bend the cover of the TU. The SSG24 TU seems to be made of a more solid material compared to the Mod24 TU. Inside the trigger box there are quite little differences:
- The trigger weight adjustment on Mod24 is removed on the SSG24. However I tested this adjustment screw and just like on the VSR-10 it doesnít do anything once high fps springs like a M150 are installed
- shape of piston sear is different
- spring of the piston sear is secured with c-clip
- in the SSG trigger box several pins and axis are secured with c-clips ó on mod24 trigger unit it is not - which was quite annoying since all the pins just fell out on the Mo24 TU when I opened it.
The piston sear of the SSG looks quite different and is narrower than the Mod24 sear.
Mod24 piston sear: 5.95 mm
SSG piston sear: 5.10 mm
I think it is better for the boltpull when the sear is narrower, because this way the sear has enough clearance to the cylinderslot and doesnít rub on the cylinderslot while manipulating the bolt. On my Well L96 - sometimes the cylinder just got stuck. The reason for that was the piston sear touching the cilinderslot .I think this was the reason why Noviboy changed sears to a more narrow one.
The piston sear of the Mod24 is incredibly sharp on the bottom. I just fired about 200 shots and the Mo24 and this sharp sear already weared the trigger sear. The SSG piston sear has a ~2mm radius on it and the triggersear of the SSG24 still looks like new.
Itís a small detail but it makes a huge difference. Thatís another point for the SSG24.
The spring guide stopper of the SSG24 is clearly CNC machined from steel while the MO24 one looks like itís molded. Modify offers an aftermarket steel spring guide stopper for their M150 spring set. I think itís that one.
The cylinders look identical. However after I had a closer look I noticed a small difference that makes quite the difference - how I found out later.
The SSG cylinder shaft compared to the Mod24 is 1 mm shorter in total while the nozzle of the cylinder head is 3 mm longer. The cylinder head of the SSG is also different. Apart from the 2 holes, which make it easier for you to disassemble the cylinder head, the ending of the nozzle isnít that sharp like on the mod24 nozzle.
The Mod24 nozzle is sharp like a knife. I had a look at some of the BBs I shot with the Mod24 and all of them have a tiny cut in them. Thatís a huge improvement on the SSG24. No idea why Modify would choose to make the nozzle that sharp?
It took me a while to find out why the cylinder is made shorter. The advantage of this whole cylinder ďimprovementĒ is that the cylinder is 1 mm farther away from the chamber, which is good when you have a strong spring inside. I recognized that the Mod24 is often changing the hop up adjustment after each shot, so I guess that Novritsch made the cylinder shorter to avoid this when youíre using stronger springs.
The 3mm longer nozzle: Novritsch advertises that he paid special attention to the BB pressure against the hopup. So I guess the Mod24 nozzle is too short?
After disassembling both cylinders I took out the internals.
I know, most of you guys will think that these two are completely identical. But there are some differences. The first difference is the color! (wow)
Thatís not a big deal, but the back ends of these two are different as you will see. The shape of the steel end is different and the SSG piston uses 13mm springs, while the MOD24 uses 11mm springs.
They are almost the same weight - so I guess they are made of the same materials.
Spring + Springguide
It is clearly visible that the SSG spring is way thicker than the Mod24 spring.
You can see the diameters down below:v
Mod24: 10,65 mm (11mm)
SSG24: 12,86 mm (13mm)
Due to the different diameters of the spring, there are also different spring guides, of course with different diameters. The SSG24 one is a massive piece. Itís nice and heavy due to the stainless steel. The Mod24 one is two piece- aluminium. The Mod24 spring guide looks very similar to the aluminium spring guide I had in my CA M24. This one snapped with the use of an M160 - so itís great that Novritsch exchanged that one to a proper one.
What I also recognized is the higher base of the spring guide. EDGI once explained on facebook why a long base is important. It centers the springguide, once the piston is locked in place. This means that it doesnít touch the inside of the cylinder when the bolt gets returned into the receiver. A lot smoother bolt return is the result and itís a huge difference between the SSG24 and the Mod24. While the SSG24 is butter smooth the Mod24 feels a bit scratchy.
HopUp chamber + Bucking + Inner Barrel
This part will be very interesting for most of you guys I guess, because there are some tiny details which make the gun shoot much better. Experienced airsoft snipers with enough tech knowledge will confirm.
The shells of the hop up chamber is the same on both rifles. Before disassembling the hop up chamber, letís have a look how the chamber looks like inside when you adjust the hop up arm to the maximum.
On the left picture you can see inside the hop up chamber of the Mod24. The SSG chamber, compared to mod24, is WAY more effective in hoping heavy BBs. So letís start disassembling the chamber to find out the difference between these.
The reason why the SSG chamber could overhop bbs easier is its Aluminium hop up arm. If you just compare both arms with each other, you will see the big difference:
Due to its shape the SSG arm can press deeper into the rubber which causes more pressure on the bb. The SSG24 hopup arms is CNC machines while the Mod24 arm is die cast. As we all know the hopup arm is one of the most important parts for a great shooting rifle. While Modify saved some bucks here- Novritsch went all in. The shape of the prongs are also different. The SSG24 ones are 45į angled which makes for a greater surface on the bucking.
The next detail I found is this:
The clickpin, which helps you to adjust your hop up and keep this adjustment during the game, is also different. Due to its longer shaft it is a little bit harder to adjust your hop up, but it keeps the hop up arm in the right position. I personally liked this feature, because the mod24 changed the hop up adjustment after each shot while using harder springs. The combination of the shorter cylinder and extended clickpin of the SSG solves this problem. Thatís clearly a big improvement compared to my mod24.
Shape and colour is clearly the same. The SSG24 feels a bit softer - but it shot a few thousand shots and is old compared to the brand new Mod24 one. They might be the exact same part - not sure tho.
The inner barrel is a point where I can talk only about optical differences, because I donít have the technical equipment to measure the specs. calliper wonít do itÖ.
The SSG24 inner barrel is 6.01 (at least thatís what he claims)
The Mod24 inner barrel is 6.08
The color between these inner barrels are different, as you can see:
I tried to scratch the outer surface on both with a knife. The Mod24 without the colour coating got scratched much easier. The surface on the SSG24 barrel is surprisingly hard for an aluminium barrel.
Also the cut is a little bit different. The SSG inner barrel (the black one) has a bridge at its top. I donít know why, but maybe for R-Hop modification or something else. Also itís much deeper. I guess thatís due to the hopup arm that is pressing in deeper.
The SSG inner barrel is also 1 cm shorter than the mod24 barrel. APS-2 cylinders donít have that much airvolume. Shorter is better in this case, but I with Novritsch would have made it even shorter, so that Joule creep would be easier.
The magazines look very similar, but there are also some tiny differences.
The magazine capacity of both magazines are the same. The Mod24 magazine has a LED module integrated for tracer bbs, which is activated when the magazine is put into the gun. This will only work if you shoot right after reloading which is kinda pointless. But itís a fun gimmick I guess.
I knew that there should be one last detail on the magazines, because of the fact that my mod24 has feeding problems from time to time. If you look at the picture down below, you will see the different shape of the BB outlet. Itís about 2mm wider which might be the reason why the SSG24 magazine feeds so much better.
The follower of the Mod24 looks damaged at the top. Every time when I run out of ammo and want to cock the Mo24, it just gets stuck at the end and I canít move the cylinder all the way in. I think that should be a ďsignalĒ of your rifle that your magazine is empty. So the follower just blocks the nozzle and doesnít let it get into the chamber.
The magtop of the SSG has a diagonal shape at its top and doesnít have this ďfeatureĒ. It is obvious that your cylinder head will smash the follower if you cycle quickly, which might even crack the magazine apart. So I think Nov just wanted to prevent this and made the follower 45į
The mod24 compression is quite good. It takes about 3-5 seconds for the piston to hit the cylinderhead when the barrel end is closed. The SSG24 is perfectly sealed. Everybody who tried to get this perfection of seal with a L96 or VSR-10 knows how hard it is to achieve that.
Another plus for the SSG24
I went to a shooting range with my friend and our rifles. We set up a torso sized target at 40 meters.
MOD24: 2/5 Hits ó weak hop up effect - had to aim higher to hit the target ó not super consistent, but decent for a stock rifle.
SSG24: 5/5 Hits ó nice trajectory even with 0.45g BBs ó great consistency ó very precise. Actually donít comparable with the mod24 in terms of range and accuracy
Here the small differences show their importance - the SSG24 blows the Mod24 totally out of the water.
Hard Facts about performance improvements
-Mod24 outer barrel wobbles ó SSG has no wobbling due to its new designed bull barrel and third connection point (bipod stud)
-Inner barrel of Mod24 is not stabilized - SSG24 has barrel spacer and oring in endcap
-SSG has O-ring for anti wobble of stock length adjustment.
-Parts of Trigger Unit are of better material and designed smarter for handling stronger springs and less malfunctions
-SSG24 holds the hopup adjustment - Mod24 cannot hold it with strong springs
-Mod24 Nozzle damages BBs while loading. SSG24 doesnít
-Nozzle of SSG24 is longer for better BB placement and more consistency
-SSG24 can hop heavy BBs while Mod24 can only hop 0.28g BBs maximum
-SSG24 Inner barrel is designed smarter and surface is harder + itís a tightbore
-Mod24 magazine has feeding issues sometimes - SSG24 barely has feeding issues
-Mo24 magazines are likely to break due to bad designed follower
-Mod24 has a slightly scratchy bolt pull. SSG24 bolt pull is butter smooth
-SSG24 seals 100%. Mod24 is slightly leaking
-Shooting Test 40m with 0,40 g bbs on torso sized target:
SSG: 5/5 Hits
Mod24: 2/5 Hits
I have to admit that Iím impressed.
I hate to give it to him - but he really did some magic to the Mod24 and didnít just rebrand it. (unlike his edgi kitsÖ..)
At first I thought that there would be many unnecessary details like the colour of the piston, just for pretend to ďcreateĒ a new gun. I was wrong.
As I already mentioned before, when it comes to accuracy and consistency the SSG24 blows the Mod24 out of the water.
However the Mod24 is still a great base and with some tech knowledge, upgrade parts and DIY mods it can be made a great shooter too.
I hope that this thread can bring some clearness to the endless discussions on - ďis the SSG24 the same thing as the Mod24?Ē-
Last edited by gigi; 07-31-2018 at 01:59 PM.
|07-31-2018, 04:54 AM||#2|
Join Date: Jul 2017
This is some very nice information. In his "m40a3 stock" video in one of the cnc machines there was a modify sticker on it
Action Army Teflon Cylinder kit
Action Army S-Trigger
Action Army Spring Guide
Action Army VSR Piston 90 Degree
Action Army M150 VSR
Action Army VSR Hop Up Chamber
Action Army 430mm 6.01 Lapped to 10 micron
Airsoftpro Steel Bolt Handle For VSR
Harris Bipod Replicas and 1-5x24mm Shortdot with illuminated reticle and tower adjustment
Maple Leaf 75 degree decepticons bucking
Maple leaf omega nub (aka concave nub)
|07-31-2018, 10:51 AM||#3|
Join Date: Mar 2017
I wish I could say I'm impressed but let's look at other results. A Combat Machine can hit 5/5 on a torso from 40m firing .28's. That's only 120-ish feet. A well tuned AEG can plug a Coke can from that distance with .3's over and over and over....and for a lot less money.
Did Nov improve the stock MOD? Apparently so, but if a stock MOD can only hit 2/5 on a torso at 40m, it should be scrapped. It's broken. hehehehe. Not saying this to come off like an a**, but let's think about it for a moment. For the amount that Nov is charging for his rifle, I would expect 10/10 at 75m on a head sized target (which is not unrealistic from what we normally see on here).
I get it, it's out of the box, etc, etc... well, if you're going to buy out of the box, spend that dough on one of Reliku's creations. Money way better spent...and you're supporting an engineer as well as getting something really on point.
I have to say on average that most stock guns are junk. We're basically buying a chassis to load better things into. The only stock gun I'll run is a Combat Machine and that'd be for CQB where range is irrelevant and we're firing .2's anyways. Oh, I don't play CQB..so mods it is! hahahaha...
..and nary a whisper was heard..
Members that say thanks to Zero Roaster for this post: Boban427
|07-31-2018, 11:03 AM||#4|
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: St. Louis Missouri
I feel about the same. I think the whole out of the box statement is just horse sh!t. Snipers are the easiest guns to build/upgrade. I can see an aeg gearbox scaring people but BASRs are so simple. I have only used one SSG24 and my built vsr cycled smoother and easier with more power. They both shoot pretty straight i didn't have time to really compare them for range and all that. i just took a couple shots mid game when i noticed the other rifle in the hands of a team mate. It was a solid performing gun but imo not worth the cost of an upgraded vsr.
|07-31-2018, 11:31 AM||#5|
Join Date: Mar 2017
Much the same sentiment here, KillerDad. The only example of an SSG24 I saw here was fair, but not exceptional. Certainly no match for the tweaked units we had running around in the bush. Again, I cannot over emphasize enough how marketing preys on our tiny minds and gets us to accept norms that are absolutely ridiculous. I'm no different, except that once fooled, there is no end to the level of research I'll go to to disprove, debunk, and discredit.
When I got into airsoft, oh my goodness the tales of awesomeness. Shooting the bum hole out of a grasshopper at a 1000 yards! Wow, was there anything an airsoft rifle couldn't do? Never mind the 7.65x54R, this fall we're hunting with a .4g BB!!! hahahaha
Ok, not quite, but hyperbole sure is fun, right? Anyhew, after hearing all these stories about fantastic guns that shot ridiculous distances, and the one I just got for Christmas being such a lacklustre dog, well, surely these couldn't be the same ones, right? When all else fails...into the secret lab we go.
Step 1: Limitations of the ammo. This is the first thing everyone overlooks. The finite capability of the projectile. That is your definitive maximum range as determined by physics. That's an equation where all forces balance to achieve maximum controllable (very important) flight. Once you've established that, then work on a gun to deliver that. So, in theory, choose a BB, then build the gun to suit....instead of trying to find the BB which works best in a certain gun.
Step 2: Keep your eye on the prize. Once you've established a benchmark, stick to it. Don't get side railed. I set hard criteria for my rifles and until I've exhausted the limits of that criteria, I'm not done experimenting yet. For example, I'm working with a .3g BB at the moment. Have been for the last two years. Continuously refining the various platforms to best support that weight. That's how you build a rifle...I know the BB can do 'x', the rest is tuning.
Step 3: Don't quit. Ever. Not getting the result? No big deal....we're not working on world hunger here. Take a break, do a little fishing, play a few jazz gigs, the problem will wait. Then hit it again with fresh eyes. Bingo...solved!
So, point of all this is that there's a big difference between commercial offerings for profit, and science. I fully understand the companies, and guys like Nov who are making a buck and have limitations other than science. Timelines, cost structures, and the almighty profit margin. What you cannot expect from those sources is optimal anything. They are simply not geared to do that.
Art takes time.. :)
..and nary a whisper was heard..
|07-31-2018, 12:41 PM||#6|
Join Date: Jul 2017
Very very nice product review, thank you.
I remember reading the list of changes (well, some of them) before; Nov posted them somewhere i can't remember.
There will always be different opinions on what's the right choice, but he has definately gone it through with a fine comb and adjusted it the way he wanted.
Good example is the default 9mm springguide/spring/piston choice instead of 7mm...most other manufacturers would consider it a waste of effort to change production for that, but overall it is a better choice.
I would like to have seen more photos of the bucking design and hopup arm design (where it touches the bucking), simply to judge how effectively it grips.
The materials don't look fancy in the SSG24, but obviously the normal bolt action pit falls (cylinder head touching hopup unit, guide ring/cylinder centering, hopup design, outerbarrel/receiver wobble) have been observed and improved.
IMO it's safe to say that the SSG24 is an entirely different rifle in the end result than the MOD24.
|07-31-2018, 12:45 PM||#7|
Join Date: Jul 2017
Judging from that as well, about the only things to improve on the SSG24 is the piston weight (it does feel kinda lame to shoot IMO) and maybe the bucking design (will see).
|07-31-2018, 01:02 PM||#9|
Join Date: Apr 2016
|07-31-2018, 01:35 PM||#10|
Join Date: Mar 2017
..and nary a whisper was heard..
|07-31-2018, 02:19 PM||#13|
Join Date: Apr 2016
Agreed on the .3g ammo being a solid middle ground- probably the heaviest I need realistically in my dense temperate rainforest, haha.
I'm pretty sure Airsoftoloy's SSG review mentioned that.
For VSR nozzle/chamber contact: Get a delrin [or other appropriate-material] ring and sand it down to paper thin and put it around the nozzle
All friction gone, and I'm assuming it isn't screwing with BB placement negatively [while I'm still getting 100% air seal].
|07-31-2018, 02:28 PM||#14|
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Rice, Washington
This may be flawed logic...
But for 1600 dollars I can buy a one mile rifle.
I cannot shoot my buddies with it mind you, but it has the range of ONE MILE.
I balk at spending even half that on a airsoft rifle. Even .177 air pellet rifles @1200 fps with scope are under 300 bucks!
Why is airsoft so expensive? It comes from Asia sure..... but so does Benjamin, Gamo and Crosman probably?
And unlike a Benjamin air rifle which is ready to kill small critters right out of the box? Airsoft rifles needs a pile of after market parts to make the damn thing skirmishable....
I dont get it.
|07-31-2018, 02:38 PM||#15|
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: St. Louis Missouri
) so they are going to cost a lot more.
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