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Old 12-20-2019, 06:42 AM   #1
RX79_G   RX79_G is offline
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greetings from a filipino in japan!

hello! im planning to buy my first BASR, tm vsr 10 along with some important accessories..... improving accuracy at 40m is my only objective since most TM guns, AEG or BASR, has the only maximum range of 40m anyway...(correct me if im wrong though)

as for the bb weight choice, for now i will use g&g .20 because of the field i played here in japan...

i have my research done and i conclude that my first try of buying accuracy upgrades are:
-action army hop up chamber
-maple leaf hop up rubber autobot 60 degrees
-AA 500mm 6.01 inner barrel

my other accuracy upgrade choices are:
-AA 500mm 6.01 tightbore barrel
-pdi w-hold
-ML hop up arm

lastly, i post this video here and i hope this will help..take note though that he use the vsr 10 in stock form.....i dont understand what he said despite i live in japan for a few years but observe the accuracy and the BB weight he used...

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Old 12-20-2019, 10:24 AM   #2
Myzur   Myzur is offline
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Your range comes from your bb weight, not the muzzle velocity of the gun. Just because it shoots less than 1J doesnt mean they aren't putting a heavier bb in there, with a sniper you should be using a minimum of .4g bbs for optimal range. The .2g will actually bleed velocity quickly due to the extra light bb, if you want to keep it light but maintain muzzle velocity then I would suggest a .32g but you may over hop that with the setup you chose.
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Old 12-20-2019, 11:17 AM   #3
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The ML hop arm will work better with ML buckings on an open window barrel. If you get the PDI W hold you should run it on a bridged barrel and get a different style arm!
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Old 12-20-2019, 01:10 PM   #4
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I am currently getting 70m max effective range (7/10 hit/miss with some over hold) at just over 1J (either 330 or 350fps w/.20 I can't remember) using valken .30 bbs and just slightly over hoped. 50-60m shots are 10/10 quick and easy with little to no over hold. Using a well sr-2 with a lost of modified but all stock components. I like the .30 over the .40 in the way that my .40 did not give me a ton more max range (there was some and maybe 9/10 at 70m) and the .30 at 30m-50m seems significantly quicker to reach the target. Plus they are dirt cheap comparatively.

I did step this off these ranges so I am pretty confident these were the ranges I was testing at (I need to break down and get a range finder lol). I may try to tape it of sometime to be %100 sure.

I also have another simular setup with a well VSR. Not sure exactly how it performs though as I haven't test it in a long time. It should be as good or better I would believe.

To be honest, at 1 Joule, I would just use the stock hop up unit and shim the hop up arm and maybe do the TDC mod. The AA tight bore would be nice (volumize it to the bb weight you will be using). Definitely go with a nice ML bucking and appropriate nub.

Last edited by Jbrinker1; 12-20-2019 at 01:28 PM.
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Old 01-02-2020, 02:02 PM   #5
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Check out airsoft sniper mechanic's 1joule build.

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Old 01-02-2020, 03:36 PM   #6
1tonne   1tonne is offline
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Range does come from velocity but it is a mix of velocity and bb weight. Normally, the heavier a bb weight is, the more range but you do need the energy behind the bb to get it out fast enough before the backspin starts to decay. So at 1 joule, I normally use 0.28-0.3gm. At the most I would use 0.36. If done right you will also be able to backspin 0.4gms but I don't think you will get as much range as the lighter bb's because of the backspin decay.
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Old 01-03-2020, 10:07 AM   #7
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Quote:
Range does come from velocity but it is a mix of velocity and bb weight.
I agree, heavier does not equal more range necessarily. It is a balance of the initial velocity, power, and bb weight to get max range. Now if my logic is correct, even at the same muzzle energy, firing at a 30deg angle, a heavier bb should go further since air resistance has less effect on a denser object (heavy bb) until the velocity gets so low it gravity pulls it to the ground quicker than it can travel out towards the target (like trying to throw a bowling ball and basket ball, which one goes further, then launch them both from a cannon, which one goes further now?).
Quote:
Normally, the heavier a bb weight is, the more range but you do need the energy behind the bb to get it out fast enough before the backspin starts to decay.
I think this is the biggest thing heavy bbs have going for them, the back spin decay is less than a light weight bb because of inertia. Plus you need more back spin to help them fight gravity (which backspin effectively keeps them in the air longer and letting the horizontal velocity take them further). Also, the more elevated your shooting angle becomes, the more it fights horizontal component which means less range the higher you need to elevate shooting angle. So in all reality, a heavy bb shooting flat has MORE TOTAL energy than a lighter bb shooting flat when the chrono says they are the same. At some point though (like 1tonne is saying), due to air resistance and gravity, with a given output energy, there is a bb weight to give you max range and it may not be the heaviest ones you can find. I could be off on my thinking so please correct me if I am as I too want to learn all I can about this and definatly no physics expert (I have taken a few courses in college though).
Quote:
So at 1 joule, I normally use 0.28-0.3gm. At the most I would use 0.36. If done right you will also be able to backspin 0.4gms but I don't think you will get as much range as the lighter bb's because of the backspin decay.
Like I was speculating before, the back spin decay should be the thing that is working for the heavier bbs as there should be less decay with a heavier bb plus more needed spin for flat trajectory. I just think the initial velocity just isn't enough for that low power output to get the bb to the target before gravity pulls it to the ground. I do feel like I had a little more range with .40s than the .30, but the extra time it took to reach my common range wasn't worth the little range increase the .40 seemed to give and also the price difference between the two. I know there was a significant range increase between .25s and .30 on my 1J build and time difference to reach my common range was insignificant and extra cost was worth going from .25 to .30 for me for those reasons. Now on my 1.9J build it is totally worth using .40-.43s as the range benefit is very significant compared to the .30s. Some time in the future I want to test some other weights in my 1J build (like .28, .32, and .36) but for now the .30 have worked great for me.

To make a long story short...
1. Heavy bb.s do not equal more range. There is a bb weight for a given power output for the most range (1tonne has done way more than 1 ton of testing and with the little testing I have done, his research has been very comparable and so I feel like he is spot on his findings).
2. Even if a given bb weight gives you the most range, time to most common target may not be acceptable. In my case 50m with my 1J build and .30 is pretty much a sure thing even if target move some. This is the range I see most common and try to sneak into. With a .40, if the target moves, I missed due to it being slower at that range.
3. Find the most common range you will take shots from (maybe that is at your max range) and start with 1Tonne suggestions .28-.36 and experiment with those first. Or if you are not the type to experiment, trust his and others experience and pick one. Lean heavier if common range is longer and lighter if it is shorter.
4. Don't use under .25g or over .40 unless you love to experiment and have the time and resources to throw at it (I don't feel like it is wasting if you are enjoying and learning from it and have the ability to do so).
1tonne and kazuchan like this.

Last edited by Jbrinker1; 01-07-2020 at 09:51 AM.
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