Curious on thoughts about the Maple Leaf MLC 338 (VSR10 based rifle) - Airsoft Sniper Forum
       

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Old 02-18-2020, 07:23 AM   #1
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Curious on thoughts about the Maple Leaf MLC 338 (VSR10 based rifle)

First I want to thank all the ‘regulars’ here that have contributed a great deal of their time and expertise. It has helped me a lot as a new comer in understanding the minute nuances about both airsoft sniper rifle tech and game play strategy.
Secondly, I was wondering what folks thought about the ‘new’ Maple Leaf MLC 338 offered by airsoft Taiwan (https://ast-gun.airsofttaiwan.com/in...roduct_id=2639). I realize there appears to be a strong lean on action army and laylax parts here — but I don’t know if it’s because of their longer presents or because they really are just superior parts. The all Maple Leaf parts seem like a good value, and I’ve always been a proponent of keeping to one company when ‘building something from scratch’ to reduce compatibility risk. The price point also seems fairly reasonable for something ‘stock’. So any thoughts or even experience?
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Old 02-18-2020, 07:51 AM   #2
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The lean on AA parts is due to cost and availability. AA is essentially a laylax copy, so the quality is typically good for the price. The parts are also easier to get for most in the US and Europe.

The ML hop chamber also isn't as well known for superior performance like the AA chamber is. That, I would say, is the main reason. Not that you can't get it to perform well, it's just not as drop in and go easy. That would be the main drawback to the ML rifle that I can see (again though, you can get it to perform properly).

The rifle you've linked looks good and properly built for the price. It's right around the same cost as the Novritsch SSG10A2 (and they both come with the Maple Leaf Stock). I'd say you can't go wrong with either, but if you wanted to save money, then get the SSG10A1.
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Old 02-18-2020, 08:08 AM   #3
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I would recommend an ssga1 over this, and this over an ssga2. For the extra money put into the stock, you can make a stellar a1.

Contrary to Accurate, I have heard great things about the ml chamber. The biggest and only drawback I have heard, which I wouldn't exactly categorize as performance problem, is the lack of micro-adjustment on the ml chamber. On the AA chamber, the hop-increase scale is smooth, while on the ml chamber, the hop increase scale is incremented. What this means is, if you find the perfect hop flight path settings to be right in between two settings on the ml chamber, you are kinda screwed unless you do some modifications.

I would say a large part of the reason many of the cylinder parts are unspoken of is due to the fact that most of us aren't rich, so we have a tendency to purchase what we no works. This leads to a cycle of purchasing ol' reliable rather than taking risks on new things. Me for example: I'm a college student who cannot really afford to spend a bunch of money on a lemon... If you look at the crazy jet, one of the most highly acclaimed barrels on the market, it was out for a LONG time because anyone actuslly started recommending it. Same with TNT barrels, and the mr-hop. People don't want to waste money when they know what works works. It is for those reasons (and many others) that I hope to be super rich one day and able to test out all of the products on the market 😄

Summary: looks like a super solid build where you can't really go wrong, but it's competitor, imo, offers more bang for buck. If this was offered without the stock, and instead, a normal tm stock, I would definetely be recommending jt to everyone.
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Last edited by Sodium; 02-18-2020 at 08:25 AM.
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Old 02-18-2020, 08:28 AM   #4
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I would recommend an ssga1 over this, and this over an ssga2
+1. The only "upgrade" this has compared to the A1 is the zero trigger, if you plan to shoot hard (>M150 spring) and stock. The A1 has more bang for the buck. However given this is slightly better than A1, for the price of A2 this is slightly better because the only difference between A1 and A2 is the stock.
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Old 02-18-2020, 09:15 AM   #5
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Well, the SSG comes with a Bulltrigger, which is equivalent (or potentially better due to simplistic design) to a zero trigger in durability and the trigger pull likely isn't much heavier.

Also, I never said the ML chamber was bad, just that it wasn't as drop in ready as an AA chamber and would take a little extra tuning to get it shooting as well.

Basically if you're in love with ML parts, get the ML. If you just care about performance and want to spend as little as possible on the base gun while having good reliability, then get the SSGA1.
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Old 02-18-2020, 09:23 AM   #6
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Hell, the A2 stock is exactly the same ML stock.

A price tag of 500 dollars is a tad bit expensive, considering the fact that all the parts when bought separately is probably notably cheaper than this, but hey having somebody doing it for you is a plus.

The ML chamber is one of the things I recently threw into my spare VSR along with the ML Zero trigger I bought. The AA Zero Trigger has been an absolute piece of garbage for me and I can't say I would recommend it, but while the ML Zero trigger is all snug and robust as hell, the sear spring produces a very noticeable vibration noise which is probably not very audible from afar but still annoying.

The ML chamber is something I would want to test out this weekend. With about 20 clicks and a small adjustment range, the problem of "stuck between a bit too much and a bit too low" is probably a non issue. Airtightness test so far is similar to AA chamber so it shouldn't be strictly inferior as long as it doesn't curve.
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My loadout:

-Main: Ares Amoeba AS02
- Inner Barrel: Maple Leaf Crazy Jet 310mm 6.04 barrel
- Hop-up bucking: Maple Leaf MR. HOP 60 Degrees
- Spring: Custom
- Cylinder: Edgi Nemo cylinder kit
- Chamber: Action Army blue chamber
- Spring Guide: Edgi Nemo cylinder kit
- Piston: Edgi Nemo cylinder kit
- Scope: Discovery 3-12*42

-Sub: Tokyo Marui 5.1 Hi-Capa

Last edited by TenshouYoku; 02-18-2020 at 09:30 AM.
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Old 02-18-2020, 09:39 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sodium View Post
I would recommend an ssga1 over this, and this over an ssga2. For the extra money put into the stock, you can make a stellar a1.

Contrary to Accurate, I have heard great things about the ml chamber. The biggest and only drawback I have heard, which I wouldn't exactly categorize as performance problem, is the lack of micro-adjustment on the ml chamber. On the AA chamber, the hop-increase scale is smooth, while on the ml chamber, the hop increase scale is incremented. What this means is, if you find the perfect hop flight path settings to be right in between two settings on the ml chamber, you are kinda screwed unless you do some modifications.

I would say a large part of the reason many of the cylinder parts are unspoken of is due to the fact that most of us aren't rich, so we have a tendency to purchase what we no works. This leads to a cycle of purchasing ol' reliable rather than taking risks on new things. Me for example: I'm a college student who cannot really afford to spend a bunch of money on a lemon... If you look at the crazy jet, one of the most highly acclaimed barrels on the market, it was out for a LONG time because anyone actuslly started recommending it. Same with TNT barrels, and the mr-hop. People don't want to waste money when they know what works works. It is for those reasons (and many others) that I hope to be super rich one day and able to test out all of the products on the market 😄

Summary: looks like a super solid build where you can't really go wrong, but it's competitor, imo, offers more bang for buck. If this was offered without the stock, and instead, a normal tm stock, I would definetely be recommending jt to everyone.
Sad to say this but the SSG10 apparently is quite a big lemon (at least seen from the others), I wouldn't really suggest it unless the 2nd batch will be made and announced.

I expected some first day issues for the rifle but the amount of of stuff the rifle is going through is excessive it might as well require a complete recall and redo in factory;

- Trigger guard breaks and snaps into halves (seems rare but does exist);
- Scratchy cylinders due to poorly/not yet machined receiver;
- Unrefined outer barrel interiors;
- Very dirty bucking (literally every rifle seems to have this issue); and
- occasional misaligned hop up chambers.
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My loadout:

-Main: Ares Amoeba AS02
- Inner Barrel: Maple Leaf Crazy Jet 310mm 6.04 barrel
- Hop-up bucking: Maple Leaf MR. HOP 60 Degrees
- Spring: Custom
- Cylinder: Edgi Nemo cylinder kit
- Chamber: Action Army blue chamber
- Spring Guide: Edgi Nemo cylinder kit
- Piston: Edgi Nemo cylinder kit
- Scope: Discovery 3-12*42

-Sub: Tokyo Marui 5.1 Hi-Capa
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Old 02-18-2020, 09:51 AM   #8
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Thank you all for all the feedback so far!

@AccurateDMD
There are a couple of things on the MLC 338 that tips me towards it, one is the ability pull the cylinder out without having to disassemble the rifle, I donít know if thatís even a ďproblemĒ for airsoft players or if Iím inventing one (my experience is from paintballing nearly two decades ago Ė field stripping a marker then was a nightmare Ė we also didnít have the same internet and forum resources to trouble shoot like we do now), but the idea of having easy access to internal seems like a boon. The second item is actually the stock, I tend to find more comfort in tactical and pistol grips, therefore a base VSR-10 stock wouldnít align well for me.

@Sodium
Iím totally with you, I was a poor college student too, but now that I got some disposable income, Iím trying to at least enjoy myself. I donít have a problem spending a little more if it avoids me having to upgrade down the line. Iím in the mindset of buy once. I am curious by what you meant by Ďmore bang for your buckí - do you feel other platforms would offer the more precision, accuracy, or quieter performance at a lower price point? I feel like the Maple leaf barrel and chamber would put it on the map as far as precision and accuracy goes (not as good as your experience techie goes, but enough for a noob like me :))

@TenshouYoku
Iíve added up the parts (from the same vendor), and itís about 200 more than it put together. I had looked into getting just the parts state side but it seems like 1/3 of them are out of stock (like the stock Ė Iím guessing SSGA2 has put a huge demand on it Ė as itís the same stock) or I have to shop out from 3 or 4 different places, and when you consider shipping, buying it in totally from taiwan makes more sense.
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Old 02-18-2020, 09:55 AM   #9
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Skirmshop NL has the stock in... stock. They also have plenty of upgrade parts.

Stripping the rifle isnt a huge deal. It's rare there's an issue with the cylinder assembly on a bolt action. Typically while you're tuning, you're going to want access to the hop up chamber more often. Then once you're happy with it, leave it the hell alone lol.

I could see the removable cylinder being nice if you wanted to test a weighted piston, but again, once it's set theres rarely a reason to strip it as it's highly unlikely to break. Even if you need to strip it it will only require removing 2 screws in the stock. You can also modify any stock to allow stripping of the cylinder without 'full' takedown.
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Old 02-18-2020, 10:29 AM   #10
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When I said bang for your buck, I did specifically mean precision/performance v amount of money put in. This is a little bit unfair though, because the stock is the substantial differentiator on price. They should perform pretty similarly (assuming the ssg10a1 is not a lemon.) I personally love the weight of my original vsr stock, and will continue to run it until someone comes out with something lighter/more efficient.

-On a side note, Acura Tactical is putting out a vsr stock that takes m4 grips and stocks, and is lighter than the vsr10 stock yet significantly more robust. Check them out on instagram. According to them, the price will be comparable to other stocks on the market (so expect ~200.)
-Also looking forward to archwick airsofts new mk13mod7. Fully vsr compatible, preupgraded, and m4 grip-esqe, built in real tdc, and beautiful,
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Old 02-18-2020, 03:17 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wyz2285 View Post
Quote:
I would recommend an ssga1 over this, and this over an ssga2
+1. The only "upgrade" this has compared to the A1 is the zero trigger, if you plan to shoot hard (>M150 spring) and stock. The A1 has more bang for the buck. However given this is slightly better than A1, for the price of A2 this is slightly better because the only difference between A1 and A2 is the stock.
Doesn't the A1 have a zero trigger? Bulltrigger if I'm not mistaken?
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Old 02-18-2020, 05:00 PM   #12
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The "bull trigger" in the A1 is not easy to pull with a heavy spring, so I wouldn't call it zero trigger. Zero trigger is a type of 90ļ trigger, zero meaning super light trigger pull.
Now Nov does get a lot of hate, so the "lemons" I would take with a pinch of salt. The scratching is from the guide rings, not receiver. The receiver is actually machine finished, instead of cast like the TM or JG (open it up, you will see machine marks in the inside, it's also paralelle, instead of tighter towards the middle like cast receivers). While it scratches, the cylinder is pretty smooth. All maple bucking look dirty because of the bright colour, I suppose the dirty look means they actually shot all guns. Misalignment of the nozzle to chamber, well that's why folks want one piece receivers.
So, I think the A1 is a great rifle for the price. And I'm confident you can't build a better one for the same cost, even include some faults of the lemons, because the budget would not allow enough/quality upgrades to solve all the issues.
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Old 02-18-2020, 05:30 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wyz2285 View Post
The "bull trigger" in the A1 is not easy to pull with a heavy spring, so I wouldn't call it zero trigger. Zero trigger is a type of 90ļ trigger, zero meaning super light trigger pull.
Now Nov does get a lot of hate, so the "lemons" I would take with a pinch of salt. The scratching is from the guide rings, not receiver. The receiver is actually machine finished, instead of cast like the TM or JG (open it up, you will see machine marks in the inside, it's also paralelle, instead of tighter towards the middle like cast receivers). While it scratches, the cylinder is pretty smooth. All maple bucking look dirty because of the bright colour, I suppose the dirty look means they actually shot all guns. Misalignment of the nozzle to chamber, well that's why folks want one piece receivers.
So, I think the A1 is a great rifle for the price. And I'm confident you can't build a better one for the same cost, even include some faults of the lemons, because the budget would not allow enough/quality upgrades to solve all the issues.
I get that Novyboi is a magnet of hate but this time the issue is……quite unusually bad for airsoft standards.

The bucking is not just a bit dirty but unusually dirty, it's like a whole lot of BBs were run through them or with particularly dirty BBs. And you'd think all of the weird problems (missing guide rings, nozzle misaligned with chamber, etc) would've been found out immediately under such tests.
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My loadout:

-Main: Ares Amoeba AS02
- Inner Barrel: Maple Leaf Crazy Jet 310mm 6.04 barrel
- Hop-up bucking: Maple Leaf MR. HOP 60 Degrees
- Spring: Custom
- Cylinder: Edgi Nemo cylinder kit
- Chamber: Action Army blue chamber
- Spring Guide: Edgi Nemo cylinder kit
- Piston: Edgi Nemo cylinder kit
- Scope: Discovery 3-12*42

-Sub: Tokyo Marui 5.1 Hi-Capa
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Old 02-18-2020, 07:29 PM   #14
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Looks like quantity>quality here, folks
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Old 02-18-2020, 08:24 PM   #15
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I tend to agree with wyz on this. The trigger won't be as light as a zero. Honestly, the zero is so light I've set it off while walking around with the gun cocked. However, the Bull does look to be built to handle considerable power for a long time. Not that (either of) my zero trigger(s) hasn't (they're 15+ years old and still going) but it's worth noting.

Also, a dirty bucking just means it was tested. Idk about others, but I never clean my barrel or bucking unless it's taken a drink in some water or a mud puddle. It's just not necessary if you're not greasing your bbs up. Dirt and bb residue happens. I've never seen it negatively effect performance. If it does? Hell, take the 5 mins to clean it.

The scratching? My TM does that. With a teflon cylinder. With a shimmed outer barrel. My rifle still shoots great. Back of the AA chamber is a little scuffed, but who cares?

I mean there may be QC issues, but I haven't heard much about them. I'm a member here. I'm on the bookface, I troll other forums... I haven't seen many issues other than people with unrealistic expectations complaining about silly stuff.
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