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Old 04-15-2020, 05:06 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zero Roaster View Post
The issue with a rifled lightweight bullet is that it needs a whole pile of energy to keep flying (think .177 Varmint). This is where we see that under the influence of the hop up, the BB truly is flying (lift being generated, etc).

For the rifled bullet to work you need to spin the begeezez out of it to keep it straight so say at 500 fps, an airsoft rifle far outshoots a pellet gun with rifling, yet the pellet weighs more than a BB. A 6mm plastic projectile would have too much drag to inertia ratio at 500 fps to make it stable or practical at any of the ranges we enjoy with an airsoft gun. You either have to give it more mass like a .22 pellet, or a whole lot more speed like a .22 short. Either way, yes MED's would have to change substantially, as would the tac gear...y'know what, just don't do it. hehehe
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Old 04-15-2020, 05:20 PM   #17
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OK hold on. There are many different rifling styles. Revolver rifling does let’s say 1:100 to 1:20 (one full spin in 100 inches to one on 20 inches) so it’s no even along the barrel. You say the velocity needs to be way over 500fps. What if we use rifling 1:5 (one full spin in 5 inches) or even less? So the high energy at the start of the projectile will be turned into a very fast spin but not exit velocity of the projectile. Maybe there’s a way to make it spin very fast but under 500fps, not like in firearms?
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Old 04-15-2020, 07:31 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Sodium View Post
Also @TenshouYoku, Mr. Hop is not just rhop for dummies. It is unbridged, which is already very different. Maybe (?) it performs the same as a Zero Rhop, but it's still certainly not the same thing.
You do realise unbridged R-hop patches are a thing before MR Hop bucking is a thing, right? It wasn't done as much as bridged barrels because cutting out a perfectly curved patch is a pain in the rear, but they exist and they do get used. MR Hop, by all rights, is just the idiot proof version of such a design.

The concept of R-hop is never really new, and while making it directly into a bucking is certainly new, the "huge ass patch covering the entire barrel cutout" idea isn't.
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My loadout:

-Main: Ares Amoeba AS02
- Inner Barrel: Maple Leaf Crazy Jet 310mm 6.04 barrel
- Hop-up bucking: Maple Leaf MR. HOP 60 Degrees
- Spring: Custom
- Cylinder: Edgi Nemo cylinder kit
- Chamber: Action Army blue chamber
- Spring Guide: Edgi Nemo cylinder kit
- Piston: Edgi Nemo cylinder kit
- Scope: Discovery 3-12*42

-Sub: Tokyo Marui 5.1 Hi-Capa
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Old 04-15-2020, 07:49 PM   #19
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I'm mostly referring to the fact that most rhops are bridged, and I have seen literally no feedback on unbridged. Maybe they work, I just haven't seen or heard any reviews. I'm mostly referring to the fundamental difference between bridged and unbridged.
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Old 04-16-2020, 04:01 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sodium View Post
I'm mostly referring to the fact that most rhops are bridged, and I have seen literally no feedback on unbridged. Maybe they work, I just haven't seen or heard any reviews. I'm mostly referring to the fundamental difference between bridged and unbridged.
I tried once and failed because the rear end was cutting into the barrel. The bridge gives the patch support.
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Old 04-16-2020, 08:53 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jsmithski View Post
OK hold on. There are many different rifling styles. Revolver rifling does letís say 1:100 to 1:20 (one full spin in 100 inches to one on 20 inches) so itís no even along the barrel. You say the velocity needs to be way over 500fps. What if we use rifling 1:5 (one full spin in 5 inches) or even less? So the high energy at the start of the projectile will be turned into a very fast spin but not exit velocity of the projectile. Maybe thereís a way to make it spin very fast but under 500fps, not like in firearms?
Ok, let's get this out of the way. Rifled projectiles will never work at a safe power level for airsoft.

I don't care what the twist rate is. It won't work.

Look at a .300BLK "pistol". It typically uses a 1:7 twist barrel with a length of around 7" give or take. Even at subsonic velocities, those bullets drop like rocks by the time you hit 100 yards and you'll be well over 1 MOA at that distance with just about any load.

Those projectiles are still deadly, assuming you could hit the target, out to 300 yards+.

So let's say you try it anyway at the same power levels we currently use in airsoft. The projectile will drop like a rock. You'll be lobbing the shots like mortars past 100ft, and while groupings may end up being somewhat tighter at close ranges, I doubt that would hold over distances past 150ft - due to the lobbing.

Hop up can keep the round projectile relatively level with the muzzle at distance, and while it can introduce inconsistency in many builds, this forum has a ton of resources on how to reduce - at least some of - that inconsistency.

The only way to increase airsoft range is to up the power level, and even then the returns are not great due to the projectile. I run a 4J gun and I maybe get 10? 15 yards? more effective range than a UK limited 2.3J gun. Is the maximum range further? Absolutely. Does it make a difference for gameplay? Rarely.

There are countries that allow 6J guns, and even those aren't reliably making those often talked about, rarely seen, 100 yard headshots every game.

If you can build a rifle at 2.3J or above that can hit a chest sized target somewhat reliably at ~250ft, then I'd say you don't have much to tinker with or worry about if you're actually going to play a game with it. Cause even if you hit people further out, it's rare they're going to notice it.
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Old 04-16-2020, 10:26 PM   #22
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It would be safe to say that's gonna be a lot of damage if you manage to fling a BB (now shaped into a bullet) through a rifled barrel in the same distance as a spherical BB now does
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My loadout:

-Main: Ares Amoeba AS02
- Inner Barrel: Maple Leaf Crazy Jet 310mm 6.04 barrel
- Hop-up bucking: Maple Leaf MR. HOP 60 Degrees
- Spring: Custom
- Cylinder: Edgi Nemo cylinder kit
- Chamber: Action Army blue chamber
- Spring Guide: Edgi Nemo cylinder kit
- Piston: Edgi Nemo cylinder kit
- Scope: Discovery 3-12*42

-Sub: Tokyo Marui 5.1 Hi-Capa
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