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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'm planning on getting a Marui VSR real shock for myself for Christmas. I owned a BAR-10, with no upgrades except a tightbore, and that pooped out so I decided that instead of getting a zero trigger for my clone rifle, I'd just get a real deal TM (and the zero trigger later) I picked the real shock because the wood-ish stock is slightly more unique than plain black and, if I don't like the fake wood, one of my BAR-10 stocks should fit just fine.

Initially, I am planning on upgrading it with the tightbore from my BAR-10 (a laylax 6.03) and an M120(laylax.) This should get me around 400 fps. Will I need to upgrade the sears or can they last a couple months until I get a zero trigger? Do I need a new spring guide or will a laylax spring work with the stock spring guide?

I plan on removing the weights on the piston. Is this at all tough/risky or do I just go in there and pry 'em off with some pliers?

Thank you, in advance, for your time and knowledge.
-Eric
 

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I cannot answer every question you have here, but I will try to help to the best of my abilities.

1. Based on the fact that many people have had their sears blow out of their bar 10/vsr 10, I would say you need to get itleast a new trigger and piston sear. They seem to be the first to go on a bar 10/vsr 10. After some reading, it seemed like the sears would require a new piston based on the degree of the angle of the upgraded sears. (Someone confirm this, I remember reading up on this a few months ago)

2. I understand you would like to get the marui Vsr 10, but if money is slightly an issue, you could always just spend the money on a zero trigger and put it in the bar 10, and use the rest for other upgrades. The only difference when you are finished upgrading will be the externals such as the durability of the stock, etc.

I would personally just upgrade the bar 10, but thats just my 2 cents. Hopefully someone else can come on here and help you with the rest of your questions.
 

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You will have to upgrade the piston if you are getting Polar Star sears (recommended). The plastic on the stock piston is to soft and the sears will end up just chewing right through it. I am pretty sure that this happens on all sear sets though.
 

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I answered a question about the sears recently, when you upgrade the sears it's still the same style of piston which is not a good thing. The type-10 series have a bad design for a trigger system unlike say, an L96 or a CA M24, but they're still great platforms. The thing that changes the piston is a new trigger system which is based on a 90 degree piston as opposed to a 45, heres the post regarding that

The problem with the type-10 trigger mech is not only that the sears wear down quickly but also because it uses what's called a 45 degree system. Because of this the second sear sits at a 45 degree angle, and is perpendicular to the piston.

.......... _________/| <--- piston
..........|_________ |
......................./ \|
.....force ----> /
..................../ <--- this line is the piston sear

When you pull the trigger it pushes the second sear against that back part of the piston until it slides off and the cylinder is released. This causes the sear to chew through the piston. When you put in a heavier spring this accelerates the process. If you got new sears they would still be damaging your piston, not to mention with a 45 degree trigger mech and high power springs, the trigger pull can get a little heavy. What you need is a 90 degree trigger mech.

I believe this is how they work but, so someone correct me if I'm wrong, I've never had the chance to take one apart (yet ).

(90 degree mech uses a different style of piston)

.............................._
.................________l. l
................|________. l<--- Piston
............................l l_l
..sear flips down<---l
............................l<--- This line is the piston sear
......pivot point---> O

I don't know how the other sears are placed to keep the sear on the piston from flipping down, but when it does flip down, there is no contact with the piston as it falls, and the piston flies forward freely, allowing a light trigger pull (once again I may be wrong). 90 degree trigger systems are the zero trigger, the V-trigger, and the M-trigger. Well those are the ones I know of anyway. I believe there was a another one made somewhere, but I cant remember where it was. It's in there somewhere on noobies M-trigger thread on ASR.

Sorry about the crude drawings, but I hope that helps!

As a final note from what I have heard about laylax springs is that as you use them they shrink to a much shorter length whereas I haven't heard of PDI springs having this issue.

P.S. Periods mean nothing (in the "drawings") and are placed so "unused spaces" aren't deleted.

Sorry I can't quote it but it screws up the spacing for the drawings.

If you're going to upgrade the spring, it wouldn't be a bad idea to upgrade the trigger system although it is expensive. As for a piston, as said in the post above if you have a 45 degree system, whatever you get is going to get damaged, but I've heard very good things about polar star pistons, PDI pistons are also supposed to be pretty good but most people who use PDI automatically worship all their parts, but they are a high quality company. Personally I would go for the polarstar. As for the sears holding out for a couple months, I would say just be patient and save up for the 90 degree trigger, but I would suggest looking at other 90 degree systems out there like the V-trig which has an adjustable trigger pull.

I've heard the laylax barrels are so-so, it might be better to save up for an edGI. Also the laylax springs have been reported to shrink with use and lose power where PDI ones do not.

Between a TM and a JG, I would go for the JG. You'll end up just throwing away a lot of the stock parts anyway for upgrades, so why not save the extra $100 for upgrades. Well thats my $.02 anyway.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Well look here, I know that 90* trigger mechs/pistons are better, I know that pistons and sears wear down. What I'm wondering is how long might an otherwise stock VSR last with an M120 spring. If I remember correctly, the BAR10 comes with ~an M130 and it holds up for a reasonable amount of time like that but, does them TM have stronger or weaker stock internal? I want to know if I can wait a few months till I can get a zero trigger or if I'll have to spend money on 45* sears and a piston in the meantime.

As for the BAR10. I don't think I'll have much luck fixing that, it seems the screw hole in the body are stripped.
 

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If your running a light spring like that you should be fine for a while. The point I was trying to make is, if you're going to upgrade your spring to high velocities, spending money on sears and pistons that are just going to wear down won't do you much good. You could buy a 45 degree piston then convert it to a 90, but I don't know if the gains would be worth the work and possibly messing up a $60 piston.

I don't know about the comparison between the two, but I'm pretty sure the BAR would be able to hold up. One guy at my field has been running a stock BAR-10 for quite some time and hasn't had any problems yet. But that's just what I think, I know this is probably pointing out the obvious but I would get more than just my opinion before you buy.
 

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If you go with the zero trigger, you may chew up your piston fairly well. But as long as you are planning on getting a new piston it should be ok. Use her untill it wont fire anymore.

I was sitting the same way you were the first time I bought a Bar10.....

If you are thinking about taking the weights off of the piston, and putting the rifle in the bar10 stock... why not just up your bar10? You wont get anything more out of a VSR than you will out of a bar10. You are going to upgrade it all anyway, save some money and upgrade your bar10.

 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Doesn't the zero trigger come with a new 90* piston? Won't that work fine.

And I don't plan on replacing the stock entirely. I have 2 bar stocks plus the vsr one. I'll have one black stock, one camo stock and one wood one and I can swap them out for different games and scenarios like wood stock for nam games. Or I could chop one up and make an
 
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