Great. Just great.

That pisses me off, royally pisses me off. Not only that but where the hell is a guy gonna get military grade AR internals? Basically they are saying that with a little bit of this and a piece of that a hole over here and a groove over there my little bro's nerf gun can be a firearm. The ATF is way outa fuckin line.

Actually they are not... the ATF tested with .223 not 5.56
and you dont need military grade internals.. everything they mention in their "how to" can be gotten at a gun show.

and under their own classification you should be able to still get this GBB legally as long as it gets shipped to an FFL
but I'm sure they are going to shut that loophole soon.

All they need to do is modify the hammer pin locations on the lower and this problem will not happen.

Mojo, 5.56 IS .223.

silentfury214 said:

Mojo, 5.56 IS .223.

Click to expand...

Glad im not the only one who caught that lol.

And by their definition of a firearm a piece of sheet metal is a firearm...

Mojo, no offense, but FACEPALM.

Actually, 5.56 is the military grade round, have a higher grain count than .223, the civilian version. There are also other subtle differences. With that said, if a rifle specifically states .223, it cannot use 5.56, whereas a rifle that states it can use 5.56, can also generally use .223, though not always.

Actually, you can get the same grain with the .223 as with the 5.56 because it is the SAME ROUND!

They 100% are not the same round, I guarantee it.

Here you go, sources included.

While .223 Remington ammunition can be safely fired in a 5.56 mm chambered gun, firing 5.56 mm ammunition in a .223 Remington chamber may produce pressures in excess of even the 5.56 mm specifications due to the shorter throat.

Click to expand...

With the appearance of full metal jacket military 5.56 ammunition on the commercial Market, it has come to the attention of the Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers' Institute (SAAMI) that the use of military 5.56mm ammunition in sporting rifles chambered for Caliber .223 Remington cartridges can lead to higher-than-normal chamber pressures and possible hazards for the firearm, its user and bystanders.

Tests have confirmed that chamber pressures in a sporting rifle may be significantly higher in the same gun when using military 5.56mm ammunition rather than commercially loaded Caliber .223 Remington cartridges, according to SAAMI.

SAAMI points out that chambers for military rifles have a different throat configuration than chambers for sporting firearms which, together with the full metal jacket of the military projectile, may account for the higher pressures which result when military ammunition is fired in a sporting chamber.

SAAMI recommends that a firearm be fired only with the cartridge for which it is specifically chambered by the manufacturer.

Click to expand...

Sources:
http://www.accuratepowder.com/data/PerCaliber2Guide/Rifle/Standarddata(Rifle)/22Cal(5.56mm)/223%20Remington%20pages%20185%20to%20187.pdf
http://www.thegunzone.com/556v223.html

You know when I first saw the comment that you think the ammo is the same. I was going to jump down your throat... then I saw Dutton actually was trying to set you straight and while you are resistant... You are Completely Wrong! but I am not going to try to change your mind... I just want you to know what the manufactures of the ammo have to say.

[quote:vesenhf3][size=133:vesenhf3]
January 31, 1979:Release

With the appearance of full metal jacket military 5.56 ammunition on the commercial Market, it has come to the attention of the Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers' Institute (SAAMI) that the use of military 5.56mm ammunition in sporting rifles chambered for Caliber .223 Remington cartridges can lead to higher-than-normal chamber pressures and possible hazards for the firearm, its user and bystanders.

Tests have confirmed that chamber pressures in a sporting rifle may be significantly higher in the same gun when using military 5.56mm ammunition rather than commercially loaded Caliber .223 Remington cartridges, according to SAAMI.

SAAMI points out that chambers for military rifles have a different throat configuration than chambers for sporting firearms which, together with the full metal jacket of the military projectile, may account for the higher pressures which result when military ammunition is fired in a sporting chamber.

SAAMI recommends that a firearm be fired only with the cartridge for which it is specifically chambered by the manufacturer.

Additionally, SAAMI's Unsafe Arms and Ammunition Combinations Technical Data Sheet page states:
In Rifle Chambered For - 223 Remington
Do Not Use These Cartridges - 5.56mm Military, 222 Remington or 30 Carbine

The .223 Remington is rated for a maximum of 50,000 CUP while the 5.56mm is rated for 60,000 CUP. That extra 10,000 CUP is likely sufficient to cause a failure in a chamber that's only rated for the "sporting" .223 Remington.

The .223 Remington and the 5.56mm NATO, when checked with a chamber ream from a reliable manufacturer of each, also have discernable differences in the areas of freebore diameter, freebore length (leade) and angle of the throat.

SAAMI Technical Office: P.O. Box 338 Branford, CT 06405-0338

(Ironically, given the nature of the on-line confusion exhibited by .30 caliber shooters, no similar SAAMI advisory is given concerning 7.62 NATO beyond the fact that those who have rifles chambered in "308 Winchester" shouldn't attempt to shoot cartridges marked "7.62x39" or "300 Savage." Well, duh!)

However, the estimable Clint McKee of Fulton Armory, has thoughtfully provided a brief monograph, The difference between 5.56mm and .223 Remington chambers in the AR-15

Well then, i apologize, i have never heard of that in my life. :-[

Not an issue silent, just glad you learned the easy way.

silentfury214 said:

Mojo, 5.56 IS .223.

Click to expand...

I always heard a 5.56 had a different load, with different mixture, giving it more power and range. but i guess thats a variable; a casing and bullet from a .223 is gonna be the same as a 5.56

That topic was covered a lot if you would read the entire post.

Thank you !!!

5.56 in not .223 ..... they are very similiar ... but they are indeed different.

on the same note, I just hear on the news that the Hong Kong Police last night caught 2 male suspects in possession of K and coccaine. They then searched the their residence and found 1 machete and 2 airsoft guns that's been modified (they didn't specify, but I'm assuming over the 2J limit of HK).

Chances are these two are triad members (i.e. gang members)

To get back on topic...

So if you have a top receiver and replace the parts in the bottom and modify the hell out of it you get a working firearm? If that makes a firearm then with a lot of work I can make a AEG into a firearm. I'm sorry but most people who are going to buy these won't think, "Oh if I buy all the internals for an M16 and a GBB M16 I can make a working gun." I don't think just about anyone will think that.

I am sure they would get one shot off.... but just one. After that they wont have a hand or a face.

Woogie the did shoot the weapon 3 times loading one round in a mag at a time. I'm sure if they tried to load a full mag in there and shoot it on full auto they'd have problems.