[MGunner]

Over the past several weeks I have benn entertaining selling my Heavily upgraded BAR10, or and either buying or trading from some sort of gas powered sniper rifle, probably a Tanaka or KJW, probably the latter. I was wondering if it was worth it, what I would need to do for DIY stuff, what could stay and what could go, what I could use for an air rig, and all of that good stuff.

 

[Cheese Man]

PM reezo for great DIY stuff, Austinwolv on the classic forums makes a wonderful air rig, and check these boards for upgrades!

It is definitely worth it, especially if you can get the BGS hopup kit, and even if you can't, I personally switched from spring to gas, and the only problem, inconsistency, is solved by an air rig.

Tanakas also have way better externals than most springers you find.

 

[reezo]

I am not able to compare the Tanaka to other rifles since I've fired thousands of shots on mine and only barely handled or seen other brands. You won't be disappointed, this is my opinion.

You can take a fun look at these threads:
http://www.airsoftsniperforum.com/phpBB/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=2439

http://www.airsoftsniperforum.com/phpBB/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=2416

and if you need anything, feel free to contact me in a way or another. It is great to be able to provide help after having got so much from the great people in here

 

[MGunner]

From what i cant find, if i did try to trade my rifle, I would go for a USED Tanaka, or a KJW w/ air rig. Honestly, I think I want a Tanaka, because either way I will get a HPA rig.

 

[cerboknight]

I agree with Reezo, you definitely won't be disappointed.
The quality of the rifle is miles ahead of a BAR/VSR, but you might feel that you're getting a downgrade in performance. You're going to have to tune the rifle a lot more to get the performance out of it that you're used to, but I promise you'll be amazed with every shot.... Well maybe it's not that good, but you get the idea

 

[Wolfgeorge]

Actually you might be disappointed... Unless you run it on external rig you will always will have significant variations on the fps per shot.
At first I bought a new Pre-Ban AICS and then used ( but in great condition) Pre-Ban M700P and both have fps variations when you use propane or green gas, I want to believe that this can be improved by an external CO2 or HPA rig.
Second these are delicate it's very easy break down!! I had problems with the sears on the AICS and now I've done the coke can mod on the receiver in order to work!!
Really there not very good gas sniper rifles. I have and 2 Ares gas rifles (DSR-1 and M200 Intervention) and I'm having a leak issue on the one (DSR) but now I think I've found the solution to this.
I've handled a few upgraded VSR's and they have 1fps fluctuation!! I was stunned I've only seen this on my Asahi WA2000!
For me the most important thing is consistency, cause only then all your fine tuning (hop up, barrel alignment, bucking alignment) will work at best!

Wolf

 

[MGunner]

I plan on getting an HPA rig anyhow, so it solves that. I like my BAR10, but too many people use AEG's at my field, and i need something that I can cycle quicker.

 

[macmillan]

Mgunner, Build a long range AEG

 

[reezo]

What WolfeGeorge said. I believe, in my limited knowledge, every gas rifle is going to have problems with anything but an air rig (co2/hpa). However, if you get a PCS a version and tune the PCS valve to be compliant with the FPS regulations you might get A LOT of stability.

Before writing my actual consideration, please note I only use my Tanaka M40A1 for target shooting. I don't take it to games and never shoot people or animals.

This said, I've found that the consistency problems arise when you take shots that are around 275-300+ feet away. At this distance, at the power I am shooting at, I can forget about using any BB weight below 0.40g. The reason is I am shooting so strong that I can reach 300 feet without hop up (I have the hop up nub unscrewed to a point it is almost going to fall off the receiver) and with no lob shot.

The problem is, I was shooting .30g today and I noticed that:
1) wind is going to be a problem
2) the groupings are slightly larger than a human torso (as in 150% its size)

I do not think it is bad for a (highly tweaked) airsoft rifle, considering that I am using Top Gas but no air rig, at all.

What I noticed is that, when gas was running out (and so the FPS, consequently) my shots were RIGHT on target (provided: no wind).

I got the "more FPS do not equal a better rifle" theory smashed right in my face.

So bottom line is: an air rig is going to be the best upgrade you can give a Tanaka, but within field limits I think (and so I've read) the PCS does a good job at smoothing the edges in gas pressure.

If I was gaming, I'd turn the PCS to get less gas in the nozzle. This would give me:
1) more shots (someone confirm this)
2) dead on accuracy (it was really this scary at 200+ ft)
3) FPS limits compatibility

I cannot simply put .43g in that and get the best of worlds for gaming, because - even if I was admitted to a game (which I doubt) - then I would have a MED of more than 300 feet, judging by how the wood target was "injured".

 

[MGunner]

Thsi is scary.....

Only problem is, PCS bolts are pretty hard to find in my neck of the (literal) woods

Not to mention i Cant find a M40 or M24 in stock any were!

 

[reezo]

You are right, they are kinda rare. I do not know if this can be of any help for you, but some store in Italy has them..not a large choice but still available and PCS. They have a PCS valve but a restricted nozzle. Even with a restricted nozzle you are going to shoot as hot as pure Mexican Chili, but the PCS valve allows you to do whatever you want in terms of FPS regulation. Plus - if you get an air rig - you can use both as primary-secondary regulators.

Anyway, if you want help for buying from Italy and having it shipped (I hope you are in the EU, this would make things easier) I am available for help.

Keep your interest in the Tanaka family, if I were a "totally 100% custom super gas sniper rifle builder for $1200" I would NOT want to meet the causal guy with a nicely upgraded Tanaka and an air rig, because a simple accuracy challenge might send me home crying

I am not saying they are the best (especially in stock form), but it is true that they are some of the best project rifles for the meticulous and patient crafter.

 

[MGunner]

Link for that shop in EU? You may be my favorite new person of all time

 

[Wolfgeorge]

There's one M700 with the camo stock (like the one I have in my picture thread) I think at Den Trinity or Uncompany.
I don't have any real problems at target shooting cause I choose where and when I'll go testing ( no wind, good temperature.. Etc) but during skirmish ... Then it's a whole different gun! We start games early in the morning and finish usually at around 2 pm, so the accuracy depends on the temperature , humidity without calculating wind. One more factor is the rapid cycling of the bolt to correct your aim drops the pressure in the mag and the second or third shot are weaker thus inaccurate ( inconsistency factor here).
Hey don't get me wrong, most my guns are gas but I do run into troubles during games. To be honest the Tanaka has the most expensive repairs with hard to track down parts and it break down easy. I was lead to it by the forums and the reviews on how great it is but it's EXTREMELY overrated!
I've passed countless hours to fine tune the AICS and I'm not impressed by it's performance. I bought the second M700 completely stock (and I'm planning to keep it that way) and I've compare it with the upgraded AICS and the difference is almost unnoticeable! I was shocked but at long distances there's no much difference at the groupings!
The M700 police I bought just to try and convert it to M40A3 or A5, not because it's a good rifle. I had the chance to fix 3 more Tanaka's and ALL the owners were telling the same thing... "It [email protected]"!!
Here's some photos of both my Tanaka's

P.S. Sorry for the [email protected] pics... I'm planning to take some better, to include the DSR-1 and the last sniper rifle I'm still waiting.

Wolf

 

[MGunner]

Im not expecting it to shoot on par with an upgraded BASR, out of the box, and I have gotten over the "ZOMG ITZ A TANAKA!" Bullsh!t. Im buying it as a project gun, and expect it to take quite a while. AKAIK, 95% of the consistency, issues can be solved with an HPA rig.

 

[Wolfgeorge]

That's what I'm gessing but I can't really answer you as I don't own a rig ... Yet! I'm waiting for the Sheriff M4 to arrive first..!

Wolf

 

[MGunner]

You honestly have too many really nice guns. xD
Also, DenTrinity is sold out, and UNC only had one with silver externals ><

 

[reezo]

There you go!

http://www.safarasoftair.com/index.php?main_page=advanced_search_result&search_in_description=1&keyword=tanaka

This is the store where I got my Tanaka, it has the widest selection of Tanaka rifles and parts in Italy.

..and yes, I think it makes for a great project rifle. Just like every time you want to take your ASG to excellence, it is not a matter of which stock rifle to get but how much money and dedication you want to put in it. For airsoft guns to shoot with that adrenaline sense of satisfaction (lol) money, time, patience, trial and error and know-how are key.

 

[MGunner]

Reezo, Your amazing. Im a little rusty on my... Italian? But Google translate is a Godsend

But, damn. Price is about $583, without shipping from Italy. Althought, being PCS, that seems.. normal? But still to high for me to afford any time soon.

 

[metallicafatcat]

Reezo, out of curiosity, how have Italy's customs been lately? A few friends of mine who sell AEG products dread it and was wondering if you had any idea about it.

 

[reezo]

@Mgunner: they have an english version of the web site (I am sure you noticed the UK flag in the bottom-right part of the site) but I do not know if the entire site is going to turn into english, maybe some parts are going to stick with italian..in case you need something translated, let me know.

The retail price is actually on par for an italian customer to buy from. They are the lowest price in Italy that I know of (I do not sponsor the store, it is just simple math). For an italian customer, getting something from them or order it from Honk Kong, the UK or the US is going to cost the same if not slightly more.

@Metallicafatcat I know Italian customs are just like everything in Italy: rule of thumb is that if it is not about food, air, landscape and relaxation, you are probably into something being done the WRONG way. It could happen for customs too but I can only speak for importing and not for exporting. Importing-wise, if you use couriers like UPS, FedEx, GLS etc. there are good chances you will not be stopped. I ordered from Redwolf and they simply called me, asked me if I confirmed the package contents as "models parts" and I told them "yes, they are spare parts for a model". Nothing more. The package shipped normally, with all the normal VAT+customs taxes.

One trick is to avoid ordering from abroad during peak times, like before Christmas, where everyone orders from web sites because italian retail stores are locally dying..they have no display, no availability and such, so you are always better off a 100% web-based store.

I ordered my upgrades in mid-July so probably the entire nation was thinking more about bikinis, tan, getting a hair cut and generally being the average stupid guy on the beach.

Consider me your deep-undercover agent in the land of Italistan. If you need the lay of the land, I've been undercover for 30 years