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I found the opposite - Longbow was superior to BLS. With that said, it wasn't a gigantic difference, certainly not double the dispersion. What I would say is that if you do have trouble with rifle cant, get either a scope or rail-mounted level. Not had a chance to shoot above 36m for a while (the length of my garden) but I doubt I would do very much better overall, so I would say that you're in the right ballpark.

Edit: Not a VSR, but my old Maruzen APS96 would drop every shot into an A4 size target at 70m using Maruzen Supergrandmasters. Except when the wind wasn't kind ;)
 

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Looks like were in the same ballpart. I use bls and get those same outliers. I guess if we were hardcore we'd pop for some .68 ballbearings and find out for sure what our guns could do without bb quality as a variable.
One thing I recommend is throwing up a horsemat or some black landscape fabric behind the target. Makes tracing the path real easy and helps figure out the hiphop at defined distances and settings.

@Doctor Jest How do you look at the level and through the scope at the same time? I got one on my gun but never use it
Side mounted level, it protrudes enough that I can see it without moving my head around. Just about (y)
 

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Consider Longbow from here in the UK. I've tried every brand of BB I can find (within reason) over the years and in my experience (as anecdotal and subjective as that is, also noting it might be that my set-up "likes them") these aren't surpassed by any other brand. They are probably equaled by some and they are around £24 for 1000 but I haven't found anything more consistent - with the above caveats in place.

:)
 

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Hey fella.

As I said before, I had the reverse situation with Longbow and BLS so everything is down to speculation - and unfortunately, I don't know where they are manufactured. I suspect that they, like 95% of the BBs out there, are rebranded. Probably.

I'm using a MR 60 degree bucking (2021) and a solid aluminium nub that came with the Tridos TDC. The barrel is a 6.03-5.98mm Edgi 430mm, and energy is just under 2.3j. The longbow I have at the moment are, if anything, a little less slippery than the BLS I have but there wasn't a huge difference in the two results.....it's odd they perform so badly for you!

1) Possibly. I don't find that the system needs that long to settle in or get to temperature, so I don't know if more would help.
2) Interesting.
3) Could be. I wonder if my nub, being absolutely solid, helps in that regard.
4) Also could be. I don't know how much variation we see from batch to batch, but there has to be some.

I'm Sorry, I'm not more help, I know it's incredibly frustrating. I had a similar situation with the sniper mechanic flamingo bucking and my standard AA chamber.....only solved it by changing to Maple Leaf and Tridos.
 

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I find that hard nubs that are attached to a very rigid and stable arm is the best for everything as it is 100% repeatable hop with no squishing or movement, so I would not bother too much with rubber nubs. I've tried a few on the market plus a bunch of homemade ones, and molded epoxy which is essentially plastic is the best. Metal would be good, but it's harder to machine something perfectly than it is to use the piece for a mold for a nub, as you will have a fit tighter than .0001 of an inch, if the chamber will accept that.
I'd agree. I just switched to a metal nub (Tridos TDC) and nothing moves unless you wish it to do so. The hop adjustment wheel has a spring-loaded detent which ensures minute and repeatable adjustments, the increments are minute and it's certainly far better than the Edgi TDC I was running previously.
 

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I run 430mm with .48g and 2.3j, with no problems. It's not perfectly tuned but it's within tolerances - a point to mention is that I do run a super-tightbore Edgi and that has been posited to affect efficiency so that could indeed be a factor.

As a suggestion......you could......as an option, get someone to professionally cut your barrel down and re-crown it. That might well be cheaper than a replacement......I can't remember if 1tonne covered BBs of the heavier weights that we use more frequently these days, but the trend was that heavy weights required shorter barrels for optimal results - possibly even down to 370mm for a .48g but those figures were for an AA cylinder. You could certainly balance piston weight to achieve more efficiency (although you seem to have plenty of power) if your piston is particularly light but volume mismatch will absolutely kill accuracy.
 

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Yeah, 370mm was extrapolating from the current data, it could well be too short - and I'm not cutting down my Edgi to find out :) If I get a chance I'll dig out an old barrel.

Other than that Kociec, you might fancy a TDC? It's probably not essential with your current rig but it's there as an option. Any chance you can get hold of a slightly cheaper barrel if you're unsure about cutting down the PDI? I'd be wary about taking the plunge too.
 

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Ah mate, don't put me on the spot regarding sales - I like to keep hold of too much gear! Laylax makes fine barrels, PDI are (IMO) better. If you can live with a cheaper barrel to see if a shorter length makes a difference, then you could keep the PDI and have it cut later on potentially. I think Action Army manufacture both a 6.03 and a 6.01mm barrel at 430mm, as do Maple Leaf - and they should be a lot cheaper......£45 for a 6.04mm crazy jet, £40 for the 6.03 Action Army, and £44 for the 6.03mm, compared to £55 for the Laylax.

I wouldn't be too quick to sell the PDI - they are lovely.
 

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Up to you mate, just trying to offer some opinions/options (y) One of the crazy things I just noticed is that Maple Leaf makes one barrel for the VSR which is over 600mm.....madness!

They also, more sensibly, make a 6.02mm 430mm for £30.....lapped and polished that has to be a good option without spending loads of cash?
 

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So guys what range of ratio will be ok for 0.48bbs and 3.3-3.5J? Any freaky tech guy can help? Today evening I will calculate my crafted cylinder Volume and need to know what I should aim for :)
Test it mate.

Mr. Sword has offered options, I've offered options so really it comes down to doing some work and reading, then hitting the Chrono. As suggested, start with a barrel you don't mind cutting down and crowning yourself, then work back from 440mm or so in 10mm increments until you get where you need to be.

wouldn't sell the PDI unless you are going to buy a DaVinci, EdGi, or ESCW barrel as anything else will be a major downgrade, especially since your barrel is lapped.
This. This 100% all day.

6.01 vs 6.03 vs 6.05 or 5.98 really comes down to chasing that final 1% so I absolutely wouldn't worry about buying a new barrel as your "forever" barrel. Keep the PDI, do some experiments on a cheaper barrel and when you do find out the correct length (it really will come down to the figures quoted above unless I miss my guess, AND Mr. Sword misses his......) then have your rather nicer PDI cut and crowned professionally. Yes, it requires a little work on your part, but that's part of the sniping experience if you really want to be precise.

Anecdotally, when I initially bought a VSR (when they were very first released) I had the Marui Enhanced hop chamber and a simple 6.05mm 430mm barrel with the stock bucking - that thing shot like an absolute laser.......certainly capable of landing all my shots on an A4 target at 70m. My VSR today has an AA chamber with Tridos TDC, Edgi dual bore 430mm barrel and I wouldn't say that it's a massive improvement over my first build....it IS better but not by much......don't get caught up chasing the infinite, just exert a little effort then get out there and enjoy yourself.
 

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One issue is that no one knows the ratios for 5.98mm barrels as they are a magnitude more air efficient than a 6.03. Tighter the barrel the less air can escape round the BB.

5.98mm barrels are only starting to become more available/common and no one has had the money to spare on one to cut down.

With that said if siliconesword says something about a vsr build I would take his word. He is a bit of a vsr mastermind.
I Was about to say "Challenge Accepted" but then I thought -no :cool:

Perhaps when the ESW barrels are released but honestly, I'm not convinced a perfectly-tuned 5.98mm is going to be much better than the one I currently have, and frankly, I'm not so invested that I would lose sleep.

As far as the OP - if you follow 1tonnes data then the established trend points towards a shorter barrel than 400mm for .48 and .5g BBs BUT I don't have any empirical evidence to support that theory, it's just an educated guess based on the evidence we do have. It could absolutely be inaccurate........but if I can dig out an old barrel I'm happy to chop that down from 430mm, incrementally to 300mm using .48s to see if the theory holds water.
 

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Without going into details I have option to replace PDI 500mm 6.01 for brand new PDI 430mm 6.01 by exchange without paying. Do you think this move will be good enough to end topic of barrel length and no playing without many cuttings by 10mm per one and doing many crowns and spending $ for every single service (I have no as specialized tools). I dont wanna to make it perfect and cutting milimeter by milimeter trying to find best possible length with 1mm accuracy, but have a optimal +/-2-3 cm length and good enough ratio.

Doctor Jest you and most of VSR users use 430mm, right? Its te most common choice for standard VSR config? :)
Yeah, that seems to be the most common choice.It's darn close to optimal :)
 

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The last one is less of a thing as BBs have gotten much much better in the past 5 years since I've been playing, with them apparently being very very bad like 15 years ago.
A mixed bag but for the heavyweight BB's (anything above .3 as an arbitrary cut-off) they were mostly awful. I used Maruzen Supergrandmaster .29g and even now, they're better than practically anything else out there for consistency in weight, surface, porosity etc ......BUT they are around £20 for 500 and of course, only .29g. With that said, they were almost ridiculously accurate, and in my APS96 they still shot better than my current VSR with Longbow. Another surprise BB was the Marui Precision in .25, absolutely amazing but I think they've changed since back then....or changed the formula as they used to be a greenish off-white and don't seem to be quite as good. I seem to recall Guarder BBs around .28g were also fine but as you know, a lot of the "precision" offerings were anything but.

For the "real" heavyweight offerings you mostly saw Digicon BBs which were dreadfully inconsistent, and in some cases covered with graphite which left deposits everywhere. A few chaps developed the method of washing BBs in mildly caustic solutions (Coca cola for one) in order to address surface issues and had some success but even after careful weighing and washing the Maruzen were still king. Compared to that, we are absolutely spoilt :)
 

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We've kinda been trying to say that there's really no such thing as copying somebody's setup when it comes to snipers, as there's just so many damn variables.

Like I've said, get a cheap barrel and $40 in tools that you should probably have anyways, and cut down the cheapest barrel you can get ahold of, calculate it's volume, and cut down your existing barrel to the length where that volume would match plus 10-20mm.

Honestly your gun sounds great, and to advance to a further point you will need to figure some of this stuff out yourself as this is really squeezing out the last 5%.
We can give you advice and guidance, but our numbers are purposely vague as we do not know an exact answer, as there is no answer.

I don't like to say "+1" or "100%" (too frequently) when agreeing with someone's post but quite honestly - you're spot on and the fact of the matter is that......unless I have forgotten some of the commercially available lengths 430mm is an excellent place to start - OR even a good place to stop if you want a "drop in and play" approach.

Just to reiterate what you referred to above: A hacksaw with a decent TPI (probably around 18, much higher can be very aggressive) a solid metal file (not a bastard file, something like a second cut) then a deburring tool (sometimes known as a taper reamer) and, the item that everyone should have....a Chrono! You can add to that a vice (with some padding......) a metal ruler, a sharpie (or metal blue and an etching tool) plus a sprinkling of various grades of emery cloth/wet and dry paper.....

Bingo.

Bit of an initial outlay but it's surprising the number of uses that the above tools have, and not just for airsoft. As you say, that last 5% is always the hardest to chase.......but it's not impossible.

@kociec Honestly, you can do it. I know it looks like a pain, and there is an outlay of cash but with some patience, I managed it, and as yet I haven't screwed up one.

Either drop in a 430mm and call it good or get a cheap 430mm and experiment then carefully cut down your PDI. Bosh. Sorted (y)


From the figures I remember, there are usually:

303mm
430mm
510mm
540/550/554mm

Clearly, we don't want to look at anything beyond 430mm so you have precisely one option when it comes to barrel length.
 
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