[sqwee]

Hey guys, I'll be looking into ordering the parts for my g36e DMR soon, and have a question on battery voltage. Should I go with a 9.6v batter to use a high torque motor, or will the 8.4v batteries I have already work good enough? Also, what would the benefits of swapping up to a 9.6v be for a DMR? (RoF doesn't mean anything since I'll be locked into Semi-auto)

And, here are the parts that are worth mentioning and I would like feedback on:

Guarder Poly carbonate Piston - http://www.evike.com/product_info.php?products_id=26499

JBU Aluminum Piston & Cylinder Head Set - http://www.evike.com/product_info.php?products_id=28190
Guarder Infinite Torque-Up Gear Set - http://www.evike.com/product_info.php?products_id=27212
G&G High Torque Airsoft AEG Motor - http://www.evike.com/product_info.php?products_id=29937 - I've changed these out for a Madbull 7 metal tooth piston, Guarder Piston and Cylinder Head, G&P m160 motor & SHS gears, although I don't know what ratio yet.

Guarder Super Lucid Chromium Plating Cylinder - http://www.evike.com/product_info.php?products_id=25869 - Purchased and it seems like it will work great. Nice polish and great air seal with the other Guarder items.

Also, what spring should I be looking at to achieve about 500-525 FPS (After the spring settles) with a 500mm barrel and a properly padded piston head and AOE? Some people say that the sorbo padding will reduce FPS because you lose cylinder volume, while others say it will increase FPS by compressing the spring. I'm currently looking at either a Prometheus M135, Systema M150 or Systema M160 and would like to avoid ordering multiple springs.

E1: Post topic changed since that's been answered & parts list altered

 

[sqwee]

I will open it up and take a look at it, but I'm skeptical that stock JG gears and motors can take an m150 or m160 spring. I also doubt that both the gears and motor will be high torque, although I may go with a standard gear ratio to keep trigger response decent.

And even if the stock parts could handle it, something tells me I'll be replacing them quickly.

 

[sqwee]

I'll see what I've got in there, but I just want to avoid catastrophic gearbox failures as much as possible. I've heard good things about the JG stock motors, but as far as gears go I'm not convinced they'll handle the spring. If anything, I'd prefer that my gears are high quality so the piston is more likely to fail first.

As far as the piston goes, I'm mostly ordering that in case I screw up the AOE and sand down a tooth too much, I've got a few other parts in my cart for that purpose as well, like a spare tappet plate.

 

[sqwee]

Okay, well I'll toss the Reinforced JG gears off Evike into my cart then. I'm fairly certain my rifle is pre-2008 and doesn't have the new gears in them. But I will go with a new motor and that deep fire pinion gear, which I'm assuming I could find on Airsoft Atlanta or Airsoft Extreme?

Okay awesome, and lipo is not something am very fond of so I'll just go with a 9.6v.

 

[sqwee]

ehobby and redwolf I know both have the deep fire pinion gear

I managed to find them and a whole host of Deep-Fire stuff on ArmorytechAirsoft which shouldn't kill me in shipping for a single item. Would you recommend any other Deep-Fire items or just the pinion gear?

Also, one of the reasons people like high ROF setups in DMRs is for the trigger response in semi-auto.

I don't mind having a slower setup if I use a mosfet which allows for pre-cocking. Plus with slower setups it forces you to think about what you're doing rather then pulling the trigger and throwing bbs down range.

I don't care for trigger response TBH and ROF doesn't mean much since my gun wouldn't be field legal if it was 500 fps & full auto. At the end of the day, I'm sure that even with a high torque motor and standard mosfet installed I'll still get better response that what I have now while running a 8.4v.

And I like what goldentrigun has to say about it. I'd like to think about my shots and plan them out rather than spew BB's hoping to get a hit (Which is what I do right now because my gun is just bad. Real bad)

 

[sqwee]

I am currently using a deepfire piston for my helical gears. The build quality on the piston is excellent too compared to other pistons I've seen with full metal racks.

I've also heard great things about their tightbores and gears. Although I can't speak for end range accuracy.

I'll look into it. Thinking about it, I kind of want to get a helical gear set to help with the heavy spring, so I'll look at their gears.

As far as barrels go I'll probably swap my Angel Custom 6.01 for a Promy 6.03 since 1. I'm not liking the AC and 2. I know for sure that I'll get getting what I paid for with a Promy. I did notice Deep Fire has 6.02 barrels, but I can't afford to test out one with $40 right now.

 

[sqwee]

Deepfire doesn't make helical gears from everything that I've seen. Also, don't be fooled by "super high awesome infinity" gears unless you want the greatest durability possible while maintaining a stock motor as they absolutely kill trigger response. To the point where it is easy to half cock a piston if you aren't paying much attention.

If you want to see what I run in my spr look here. This might give you a few ideas although I wouldn't go with systema like I did for the gears. I got them for a steal which is why I have them in my gun.
http://www.airsoftsniperforum.com/phpBB/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=3049

Of course, I definitely have realized that the Guarder gears I was originally looking at just won't work very well. One guy on Evike said they ran on the large side and I don't want a ratio much higher than 18:1 and coincidentally, the Guarder gears don't mention what ratio they are.

I like that set-up for your internals, and I wish I could afford the Systema gears lmao. Also, that's a sick looking gun.

 

[sqwee]

Okay, well I'll consider some of those parts as options when I start placing together all my orders. And sorry that I haven't been able to tell you guys what the hell the stock parts in my gun are yet, I'll be cracking it open on Saturday / Sunday because I just don't have time at the moment.

Kind of frustrated though because I've managed to strip the threading on my outer barrel and need to replace it now... and possibly order a different can to boot since this Matrix one doesn't seem to thread well.

EDIT: Looking at the Deepfire Titanium Piston, is there any way to do an AOE adjustment on that without special tools? Because I'm fairly certain I don't have anything that could create a smooth surface if I tried to grind the 2nd to last tooth down.

 

[sqwee]

what is the stock inner barrel length? I have a JG g36c barrel assembly minus the fuse housing. I broke the fuse housing previously and couldn't get just the housing. I ended up having to buy both. so this is the old one.
http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/237/img0702fk.jpg
large image. Wait for it to load and it should fit to screen.

when doing the AOE the surface doesn't need to be smooth as long as it misses the teeth and there isn't a chance to hit the gear you're fine. I use a dremel with a grind wheel although I've done it in the past with a vice and metal file.Correcting AOE on that piston will take a little while. The teeth are really strong.

EDIT: on a side note I just had a nice crude chuckle when I opened that picture up.

500mm is stock length for JG g36e, I've got a 509 in there so it extends just a tad. I'm fairly certain that I stripped the outer barrel either during the process of removing the orange tip, or screwing on my Matrix suppressor.

Ahhh I gotcha, makes sense. Would you recommend steel teeth rather than polycarb teeth for high torque set ups? I'm just concerned that by using extremely strong teeth on the piston, that my gears will become the weakest link and strip first, and they're a lot more expensive than piston replacements.

ALSO! I finally cracked open the gearbox today, and in the process of doing so I discovered a few things:

1. Plastic spring guides are crap. The tabs that hold it in place snapped right off as I opened the shell up.
2. My v3 GB shell does not have a small hole in the back to hold the spring guide down while you open it.
3. I have a full black motor, and am unable to tell if it's torque or standard.
4. Polycarb piston with one steel tooth and the overall strength of it seems fragile and brittle.
5. Gears seem to be the new 2010 models and are non-helical, however the bevel gear does not appear to be one piece, and seems to me that it should be swapped.
6. Cylinder is almost full, however has one small square port on one side of it.

Besides that, the shell looks nice... and I can already tell putting it back together will be a pain in the ass, even without needing the AR latch. Without the small hole in the back of the shell, the spring is incredibly difficult to sit in the shell, and this will only get worse once I do an AOE and place a stronger spring in...

EDIT: Are these the SHS gears you guys are talking about? I notice they are indeed helical, and should I go with the "100:200" or "100:300" ratio set?

http://www.airsoftmegastore.com/SHS_Low_Noise_High_Torque_Steel_Gear_Set_p/acc-shs-g100200.htm

 

[sqwee]

I did use a flat-head to open it and the tabs just snapped off.

Okay I've tossed an AR latch into cart from Guarder. I take it that the stock one on yours broke?

http://www.airsoftmegastore.com/SHS_Original_Torque_18_1_Reinforced_Steel_Gear_Set_p/acc-shs-g181.htm

Would these be a better option than the previous ones I linked? 18:1 ratio, non-helical SHS gears. And why not get helical gears? Don't they handle stronger springs better?

EDIT: I did some reading on it and don't really see any reason not to use helical gears that will still allow you to still use a full toothed piston.

Never mind that, I think I'll go with the 18:1 straight cuts. I'm not good enough with shimming yet to go for helicals, and apparently they make terribly loud noises unless absolutely perfect.

 

[sqwee]

It didn't break. Its just the pegs were to short and didn't sit in the shell nicely at all. (ie if you look at it wrong the thing pops out of the hole.) If you think you can handle that by all means go ahead and save yourself $10. I felt it was worth it to have a AR latch that won't fall out as easily.

If you go with std ratio gears spend the time and get the highest torque motor that you can.
Just read around for people using std gears and pulling hard springs you'll get an idea of what motors will pull the springs.

Also I wouldn't say that helical gears are hard to shim. Its just people don't really want to take the time to shim them right. It literally took me 3-4hrs to shim all three of my helical gears.

Ahh, okay. Well my first batch of parts came in today. The cylinder, piston head and cylinder head. They have great seal already and are all Guarder.

The outer barrel and new silencer came in today and they actually thread together nicely, so I think I'm done with buying Matrix crap... never trusted their stuff anyways.

I'm looking at getting the G&P m160 motor which I've read a lot of good things about, and people seem to really love that motor. It's neodymium and should easily pull a m150 spring on standard ratio gears.

I'm also seeing a lot of love for the JG blue motor with some people claiming they can pull an m150 on standard gears without the motor even warming on full auto. That being said though, I think I'm going to go with the G&P m160 because:
-The motor seems to be out of stock in the short & long version everywhere
-I don't trust that any of these motors are actually the mythical blue capped m142 neodymium JG motors. I've found a number of forum posts saying that people have ended up with something else even when they thought it was the "mythical" JG blue.
-I can get it off of Armorytech for $45, which beats Evike even after shipping.

Also, I feel I should ask this before I order my AirsoftGI cart. With a rifle shooting over 500 FPS, what are the advantages and disadvantages between .3's , .36's and .4's, assuming they're all the same quality? I am really looking to be able to massively out-range the standard & upgraded riflemen at my field, and am not sure what weight is best. I see a lot of people like .4's for 500+ FPS, but they don't usually state their effective range with them.

 

[sqwee]

Okay well I'll look at the brands for .3's - .4's and perhaps I'll get a few thousand of each weight for various wind conditions.

 

[sqwee]

Bumping for quick question. Did I screw up by going with a 7 metal toothed piston rack?

http://www.airsoftgi.com/product_info.php?products_id=8928

Madbull X Factor Full 7-Metal-Tooth Piston. The sector gear will pick up on the Polycarb teeth first and I'm wondering if the higher FPS setup will strip it right off the bat.

 

[sqwee]

eh... alright well my AoE is pretty good right now and I'll fine tune it once all my parts are in. Should I get a full metal rack if this one breaks? (And what brand)

 

[sqwee]

Bah, well I'm kind of frustrated that I failed to realize/read that I'd be needing a half-tooth'ed piston with the SHS 32:1 Torque Gears.(I know, it's excessive, but I went with a G&P M160 which has nice speed and torque) I just got them in from AirsoftClub today and just now learned this unfortunately. At least I can still work on shimming them while I wait.

So it looks like I'll have to purchase a half-tooth'ed piston, and while I'm at it probably pick up another spring now that I know how to get it in there.

I see metallica has recommended SHS pistons, would anybody else recommend this as well?

EDIT: Quick scan of SHS pistons shows that they only offer half-teeth racks in full steel only (That is, unless you'd now recommend a full steel rack). This means these are my current options for half-teeth racks:
http://www.airsoftgi.com/product_info.php?cPath=31_148&products_id=8927 - Madbull "X-Factor" 7 steel-toothed Piston
http://www.airsoftmegastore.com/SYSTEMA_Polycarbonate_Piston_Half_Tooth_ZA0502_p/acc-sy-za0502.htm - Systema Piston
http://www.airsoftmegastore.com/Prometheus_Hard_Piston_Half_Tooth_B501_p/acc-pts-b501.htm - Prometheus Piston
http://www.evike.com/product_info.php?cPath=24_75_393&products_id=27237 - Guarder Piston

Can anybody vouch for any of these off the list and/or recommend a different one? (Can't order from China again, I don't have the time to wait for it really)

Also, I got a set of metal SHS bushings and one of the bushing holes for the bevel gear is a very loose fit for the new bushings and the bushing falls out whenever I flip that half of the shell over. Is this fixable and how should I go about fixing it?

 

[sqwee]

Whoa , whoa whoa. There is no need for half tooth pistons. They're dinosaur tech and none of the half-tooths are any good except the Prometheus which are expensive, and overly heavy.

But I can't use a full tooth piston with my gear set... the lower half of the sector gear is the same diameter as the top half and thus causes it to never release the piston.

 

[sqwee]

Then you need a new gear set.

-_- Okay... but why exactly are half-tooth pistons so bad? Do you have a link to anything?

 

[sqwee]

Okay, well I guess before I order anything... these are the gears that came stock in my JG g36. (I have altered the contrast on the image slightly so you can see the gears better)

I'm not sure what their quality is, but if they are these or similar to these http://www.evike.com/product_info.php?cPath=24_363&products_id=27806 gears then maybe I could just use them rather than buy a new set again since they are claimed as being able to handle m150 springs by the reviews.

Do you guys think the ones I have could handle the spring?

Also, I get what you're saying about the half-teeth, it'd be easier to remove a tooth if it was a half tooth because it has less contact with the piston than a full tooth.

 

[sqwee]

The gears you linked are very good. A regular piston should release of of your stock gear set. Not to be mean, but the way you word your sentences is very confusing and hard to understand.

Okay. I'll order those then. I agree... that sentence with the link in the middle is kind of confusing. I'll try to work on that.

EDIT: I already have a full toothed piston that has the AoE finished for it, so I don't need another goldentrigun. What happened was that I got my piston before I had even ordered the gears, and then didn't notice that the gears would require a half-toothed rack.

EDIT2: Also, metallica, do you think the stock gears I have are good enough or should I still order these gears?

 

[sqwee]

Alright, sounds good. Maybe I'll have my gearbox back together by the end of the week. Still waiting for my motor to get here though.