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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I saw a number of threads on the new 2021 silicone variant Maple Leaf MR hop bucking here, however they go against the “advised” fps suggestion from previous versions.
I was wondering what degree you folks would suggest (or had first hand experience) for an AEG shooting .32 @ 1.7joule (300fps to 350fps)
do you guys keep with the 70? or do you use the 75 or 80?
 

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I tested a silicone 60 MR vs a "normal" 60 Mr and the results were meh to say the least.
The regular rubber was bang on 325 fps (0.99J), the silicone one went from 325 of the first shot to 250 on the second, 140 third, the fourth shot was a whopping 90 fps and the fifth jammed. On zero hop applied.
Same gun, same hop unit, same barrel, same Omega tensioner..
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
@Skara

Interesting... anyone else experienced these inconsistency issues? I know on some forum threads (not sure here or reddit), they claims to have a break in period of a few hundred shots
 

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Only tried the vsr/gbb variant.
Nothing new to offer compared to the old ones. Still less grippy than Modify X-range and not proper silicone.
I use 60 everywhere. Never gone higher than 70.
 

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I just bought a 70 degree one for my vsr10.
If there's anything significantly different about it, I will post the info here.
 
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
@wyz wouldn’t 60 be too grippy?
 

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I tested a silicone 60 MR vs a "normal" 60 Mr and the results were meh to say the least.
The regular rubber was bang on 325 fps (0.99J), the silicone one went from 325 of the first shot to 250 on the second, 140 third, the fourth shot was a whopping 90 fps and the fifth jammed. On zero hop applied.
Same gun, same hop unit, same barrel, same Omega tensioner..
It sounds like you are getting too much grip, so I'd assume you'd want 80°-85° for 1J.
I borrowed a friend's 85° MR-hop and liked it, but it was so similar to a above average R-hop that I will continue using R-hop and just use a different nub for whatever I need.

The X-range sounds pretty sick, but I haven't tried one yet as I'm relatively content.
 

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@wyz wouldn’t 60 be too grippy?
60° is 60 durometer or 60 shore hardness, it's basically just the amount of force it takes to press something into it, like Rockwell hardness.
So, grip doesn't rely on hardness, but usually the softer something is the more grip it has as it deforms around the BB as well as just having more grip.

Different rubbers have different grip, such as Buna-N rubber being pretty slick compared to latex or silicone.
Also, pure silicone like the McMaster Carr tubing I use is different from an "alloy" of molding silicone like in the 2021 buckings and the Tru-hop bucking, which are a little grippier and wear out faster for some reason.

I recall seeing a weird japanese bucking that had the entrance made of hard rubber, and the patch and beyond made of a softer rubber, for ideal longevity and performance.
I will attempt to do something similar in the future by making my own bucking put of 95° tubing of some sort and a 70° silicone R-hop patch.
I may also end up doing something similar to an air rifle with 1-4 O-rings somewhere in the hop chamber or barrel, but that will probably be a last resort.
 

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I tried the 85° and was only capable of slightly over hopping 0.28s at ~1.8 joules. 0.48s would act like there was no hop applied right up until jamming on my SRS in a Kraken hop.

I'm going to mess with the barrel a bit more to see if there's something weird going on (I think there is), because it should be doing SOMETHING (the stock 60° Kraken bucking also didn't really want to do anything with 0.48s, I think my hop unit is cursed...)

I ordered a 60 and 70 to test as well, those will probably be here next week.
 

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@Skara

Interesting... anyone else experienced these inconsistency issues? I know on some forum threads (not sure here or reddit), they claims to have a break in period of a few hundred shots
they might have a break in period, but I'm not going to destroy a gearbox to break them in :p

It sounds like you are getting too much grip, so I'd assume you'd want 80°-85° for 1J.
I borrowed a friend's 85° MR-hop and liked it, but it was so similar to a above average R-hop that I will continue using R-hop and just use a different nub for whatever I need.

The X-range sounds pretty sick, but I haven't tried one yet as I'm relatively content.
I don't think it's a "grip" issue, although when I compared them side by side (so with just the barrel and hop rubber installed, not in the hop unit, because I happen to have two identical barrels) I did the bb drop test and while the rubber MR was fine (bb resting on the feed lips and close to zero pressure to push it past them), with the silicone I really had to push hard. I've checked all the quotes with calipers but found zero difference between the two.

With that being said, I have ordered a 70° MR that will hopefully be here tomorrow, along with another rubber 60 :)
 

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Odd, but I was going off of GBB/VSR buckings where they don't need to hold the BB, so I guess it's normal to have different opinions on the 2021 series.

That being said, I have a friend who swears by Madbull Redshark buckings, so maybe give them a go.
I will probably try some whenever I get my new HPA body, with R-hop of course as extra power is always nice
 

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Well all rubbers need to hold bbs, otherwise you'd have them roll off the barrel.

With that being said, I only had good experiences with Maple Leaf, Prometheus and PDI. Everything else I wouldn't touch with a barge pole, but ymmv.
Many people swear by G&G green rubbers, whereas I only had issues with those..
 

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I mean the entrance of the bucking, as AEG buckings are supposed to hold the BB on top of the feed lips and should require little effort to push through.
GBB buckings have a much larger entrance where BBs just drop right through and stop at the contact patch, as GBB and spring guns tend to not kick the BB at all, while AEG and HPA engines tend to kick the BB which is why it is held at the entrance, to lessen the kicking force of the nozzle
All buckings should keep BBs from rolling out of your barrel if the hop is turned on...

I have had a G&G green and thought it was okay, but I really like their blue as it's insanely wear resistant and relatively stiff, perfect for R-hop.
 

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I've found the 70 deg 2021 autobot has tiven me better results than anything I've used before. The little guide tiers and transparency really alllows you to easily line everything up really smoothly
 

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I've got the 85° MR.. Because I kinda misunderstood how the FPS works. Figured it was based on FPS with .2's for some reason, wasn't clearly thinking when I bought it. I'm running it through the Striker, and while it's doing better than my old Autobut, I've still got some fliers but that could be due to a number of other things. I might buy another one, one of the 70°'s this time or get one of those Modify X Range buckings.
 

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Just put a 70 degree in my 500ish FPS rifle - I can't shoot .36g bbs anymore, as even on the lowest setting there is too much hop. About 1/3rd hop is enough to flat line .46s out to 300ft. The accuracy is superb.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
@The Shaggy Sniper
I been thinking about that alot...maple leaf based the degree selection based on FPS...but rarely do they give what weight bb

I don't know if one should pick the "grippiness" based on joule or FPS? cause while most of us here believe joules is the correct measure for most things. I feel like FPS (regardless of weight) might actually have merit here?
 

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I just had a mail convo with a salesperson/tech at my airsoft store, he told me that it is purley based on FPS, and recomended me to get a 70° bucking and and correct to fps with bb weight as mentioned above. Don't know the validity to the claim tho, I guess its time to "buy and try".
 

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I just had a mail convo with a salesperson/tech at my airsoft store, he told me that it is purley based on FPS, and recomended me to get a 70° bucking and and correct to fps with bb weight as mentioned above. Don't know the validity to the claim tho, I guess its time to "buy and try".
As a general rule of thumb, when the people who designed, engineered, and produced the product tell you the operating parameters, it is best to follow them. It has been my experience - almost always - that they know best. Generally, they are able to do a lot more testing and QA than any consumer is. Now, that's not to say bugs don't come out down the line when the product is in many users' hands, but you get my point.

My gun is about 500-510 fps now, and I got the 70 degree because everything higher was sold out. Per the chart, I should have gotten an 80, and given how crazy the lift is now, I'd say that's right. 70 is too grippy, sending .36s to the sky almost straight out the barrel, hop up set to minimum.
 

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As a general rule of thumb, when the people who designed, engineered, and produced the product tell you the operating parameters, it is best to follow them. It has been my experience - almost always - that they know best. Generally, they are able to do a lot more testing and QA than any consumer is. Now, that's not to say bugs don't come out down the line when the product is in many users' hands, but you get my point.

My gun is about 500-510 fps now, and I got the 70 degree because everything higher was sold out. Per the chart, I should have gotten an 80, and given how crazy the lift is now, I'd say that's right. 70 is too grippy, sending .36s to the sky almost straight out the barrel, hop up set to minimum.
You are absolutely right, the manufacturer is almost always right (at least the good ones).
How about with higher weight bb’s? My tech/sales person recommended the 70 degree with a .45 and 120m/s in mind.
 
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