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ICS Tomahawk initial review

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#61 ·
And, I should note, this is not the nicest possible parts. If you really want to you can spend significant extra money, to get the “best” parts that will realistically net you a few % of gain, and sometimes a big headache. I’m sure y’all are familiar with that when talking about things like monolithic sniper bodies and such.
 
#63 ·
Sorry about that, I didn’t mean to sound like I was contradicting your post—just adding my thoughts. :)

The funny thing is, as much as I feel that airsoft has so few standards, I feel like snipers have even less standards than AEGs. From what I’ve read on here, and correct me if I’m wrong, but what sniper you choose as a base has a large bearing on what you need to do to upgrade it, the parts and compatibility of everything you use, and occasionally how far the platform can even go, with some snipers having hard limits based on serious flaws in design. This doesn’t tend to be so with standard AEGs (AKs, M4s, MP5s, the works). I.e. you can take Almost any M4 on the market and you can gut every single internal part and remake it 100% to your specifications Without performance repercussions. In summary, the Crappy Well VSR equivalent has the same upgrade cap as the SRS. Am I crazy?
 
#64 ·
It's hard to say when it comes to standards of AEG vs sniper, as there's brands like Ares, APS, and Krytac that have special gearboxes and sometimes special gears. The tolerances between nozzles in AEGs sounds rather large, along with hop chambers, buckings, outer barrels, external parts, and inner barrel OD.

The VSR may seem to be more precise, but I think that there is a lot less in a VSR that matters, as there is just a lot less going on.
Once you have upgraded the hop unit and trigger, there are very few parts in a VSR, so troubleshooting is easy enough.
There are less companies that make VSRs as well, while there are a million M4s out there that all seem a bit different.

All in all, they are relatively comparable in a lot of ways, but there are variances in price, difficulty, reliability, and so on, as like you said, there are really no standards except for the first gun of it's kind, like TM or Silverback.

You can upgrade any gun to make it good, within reason, but you have to account for time, effort, tools required, money, and how good the thing will be in the end. You can have an aluminum inner barrel, plastic body, and generally cheap parts that shoot accurately and far, but the lifespan just won't be what you're after, and the gun will feel like shit and generally be weak. I'm after performance AND a good experience, which you just won't get with a $100 gun that's rather stressed.
 
#65 ·
Between replicas of the same version, I haven’t personally encountered issues with nozzles. The vast majority of, say, M4s all work fine using a 21.4mm nozzle. 90% of the ones that don’t will work with a 21.25mm. (This is all in my experience) I have encountered some interesting things about how nozzles seat the BB. Some, despite being the same length, will seat BBs much farther or not as far into the hop rubber, and in one case I needed to use an adjustable nozzle to find perfect seating, and then modify an existing nozzle to properly replicate it. That is another good point; adjustable nozzles. And Maxx’s isn’t half bad.

Hop chambers are like seatbelts. Everyone has a slightly different version of how it look, but it still does the same thing. Most that I’ve used have been interchangeable, though I did have trouble with an original style M4 unit causing fit issues between the upper and lower receiver... some are obviously badly made or have different designs. I’m just generalizing.

Don’t me started on proprietary gearboxes. Hate the things. Despite the fact that Krytac is still my top beginner recommendation, I hate working on their boxes. I recently took a dremel to a Krytac box to try and “unproprietary” their spur gear issues, but no luck. I did at least fix the squeaky stock shimming. Ares and APS I at least get to call trash and flat out ignore, but I’m half convinced Krytac made their spur gear proprietary just to screw everyone wanting to replace it. :p
 
#66 ·
The gun is gonna be available stateside April(supposedly), but for another $4 you can buy the Modify Steyr Scout.

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#67 ·
Just been doing another little design. Parts of a KJ Works Mk1 carbine but altered and a VSR. But obviously, if a manufacturer was to make this, he would rebuild everything from ground up. Including a bigger cylinder. We and light and minimal. Enough room in mag well for at least a 50-round mag (we do not want it sticking out if possible). No handguard. Nylon Fibre Stock. Bolt handle at front of cylinder. Not heavy.
Image

I guess the main issue with this design is there is not much room for the trigger box. So, it may need to be altered a little.
 
#68 ·
I dig that, if the stock could be straightened and things could be more tactical that'd be sick.
For the trigger, here's a top tier 6D CAD model I spent a long time making. You could probably pull something off like this, but it might be weird and not work well.
you would either pick high pull and low trigger travel, or low pull and high trigger travel. I'd try both as it all comes down to pin placement to change this, and you could probably just drill a couple holes in a frame and fill a cavity with epoxy If necessary.
Image


Idk if anybody has seen it, but this Jap guy called Sniper Kazz on youtube made a bullpup vsr that looks like it sucks, but he did do a very interesting cylinder thing similar to your picture. A quick scroll on his main or second channel will give you a pretty good idea for how to do this thing.
 
#69 · (Edited)
I have read all the comments and i can tell the Tomahawk is an awsome rifle. I am the lucky owner for a few days now and was able to shoot it at our local traininghouse and it shoots 1,7Joule with an .30 bb.
The max in Holland is 2,3J with an .30
We have a shooting range of 60mtr. and it was spot on target after a few minutes playing with the hopup with .36bb's. I didn't had to use the left and right adjust, just the top adjusting wheel.
The pull on the bold is very easy and the triggerpull is very light.
Filling the magazin is easy to do with an speedloader and it takes 50bb's
Placing the magazin on the rifle is something you have to get use to, it takes some practice but after a few reloads you get the hang of it.
There's no need for a silencer as the rifle sounds very quiet already due to the big cilinder and soft tip of the piston.
Out of the box it's a beast, something i couldn't say of the SRS wich gave me a sour arm of pulling the bold back, wasn't very accurate out of the box and needed some upgrades before it shot straight.
The Tomahawk is an out of the box ready sniper rifle and enjoy every shot and the looks are awsome and not looking like all ather VSR, SRS's.
Anyway i am newby at the sniperscene and i am more a urban sniper player, the tomahawk is short but with an crazy range.
Indoor testrange 60mtr. spot on target in a straight line so outside (not tested yet) it would easy reach 70 to 80mtr. and thats very impressive for an out of the box rifle.
Image
 
#70 ·
Sounds solid.

I guess on here we are critical of just about everything as that is usually how rather experienced players tend to be, but there doesn't seem to be anything detrimental in this gun. Sure, it has a dumb mag, but that can be learned and maybe improved with time.

Sounds like a solid gun for somebody who is in need of a higher end sniper, but for those of us who have invested a great deal of time and money into another gun, we are unlikely to purchase one ourselves. I don't speak for everybody here, but I am not a fan of having multiple guns that fill the same roll, as that is usually a few hundred or even a thousand dollars that could have gone towards airsoft expenses or other hobbies like knife making, fishing, or my ammo addiction.
 
#71 ·
Just a few more ideas.
Straightened the stock for you Silicone.
Also made one with an M4 Stock
Bottom one has a crappy looking receiver or hand guard
Image

, but it would give room for a Zero trigger.
 
#72 ·
The bottom one reminds me of my VSR-SS, which I gave up on bc it didn't look cool and there was no saving it.

If a gun is super tall, it just looks dumb.
I think that with minor designing this could be very compact and cool looking, but it would require some custom parts and heat treating. Pretty easy stuff tho, you can soften a file in a campfire or woodstove, file/sand/saw/drill is, and then heat treat it with a torch and some veg oil. Not the absolute best, but it would totally be serviceable for this, and likely be as good as half of the VSR triggers out there in terms of quality. Designing a trigger should be easy enough if you copy my drawing and add a spring behind the rear piece, if you are able to whack that inside of a MK1 lower.
No reason you can't use even a piece of wood for this, most of the stuff is housed in the VSR receiver.
 
#73 ·
Just realised a big issue. A trigger catches the piston sear while it is pulled back. This is catching it at the rear of the reciever. So in these setups, we would need the sear to be at the front of the piston and not the rear. So some thing different.
I have also altered the stock once again to save weight and also, with the angle in the stock, it means that we do not need to use high scope mounts to see into the scope. (Sorry Silicone. Bent stock works better)

Image
 
#74 ·
I see no reason that wouldn't work, but it would need to be a special piston.
If you need, I can probably machine you a decent piston with a hardened steel thing like that, with the added benefit of making the piston a good deal heavier and not requiring as much solder and tape to get it to the 60isg gram level.

That's actually a solid idea with the catch, reminds me of a few of the nicer 3D printed nerf guns out there.
If one needs inspiration, the Nerf community is a place to look, but they suck at slim, short, and cool. I think they breath in too much spray paint and plastic dust maybe. They do have some cool guns that use a cylinder and plunger system under the barrel resulting in a different prime method, and form factor. There's a couple pistols like that too, which have the potential to be a high power sniper spring pistol if some things were tuned a bit.
 
#75 ·
1tonne said:
Just realised a big issue. A trigger catches the piston sear while it is pulled back. This is catching it at the rear of the reciever. So in these setups, we would need the sear to be at the front of the piston and not the rear. So some thing different.
I have also altered the stock once again to save weight and also, with the angle in the stock, it means that we do not need to use high scope mounts to see into the scope. (Sorry Silicone. Bent stock works better)

View attachment 21687
Click to expand...
That kind of already exists. KJW MKI Gas Powered Non-Blowback Airsoft Carbine Rifle, Airsoft Guns, Gas Rifles (Non-Blowback) - Evike.com Airsoft Superstore
Its missing some of the check boxes, but I have one on order. Going to do somethings to it.


Then again if I was building a rifle, I would design it more akin to one of these. 1827 F BIONIC (anschutznorthamerica.com)
 
#76 ·
The issue with the MK1 is it's only capable of so much accuracy as the barrel moves and wobbles a lot for every shot. This just gets worth with the long barrel as there is more opportunity for the thinner than average barrel to get all screwy and guide the BB in a dumb direction. This is the reason Blind Sniper quit on his MK1 he dumped close to a K in, he was getting piss poor accuracy for the price of 4-7 SSX23s.
The MK1 is a sidearm, but the MK23 is much more than a sidearm, and beating it at it's own game may prove difficult, especially when not made by the best game in town, or Tokyo to be exact.

I think 1Tonne's and now my goal is a relatively VSR based gun that is actually small and handy, not just an expensive skelly stock from Maple Leaf to shave weight.

As for the Olympic pellet gun, that's got some good traits but it needs some stuff. I'd change the stock, keep the grip, and do something different with the handguard. White guns are just cool, like the Vector, a white SCAR or ACR, or the mythical Strike80 Glock frame.
Gotta use white Delrin on my stuff more often, not just inside of it.
 
#77 · (Edited)
My main aim for this rifle (and pictures) is actually for a manufacturer to see this thread and to make one similar. So, they make something along these lines as there is no bolt action rifle like it. (The KJW Mk1 is not a bolty)
There are plenty of spring rifles out there that look really cool, but they are heavy and bulky and long. We need a specific sniper rifle made just for airsoft. Not a copy of another real rifle. If we did get one, even if it was not the coolest looking, it would still be a big seller because long term snipers prefer function over form.
It could be VSR based but really, I think the market is slowly moving to longer cylinders and so it may need to be something new
 
#78 ·
I think that there needs to be more effort put into gas snipers.
If you had a mag with a really huge gas capacity then FPS output would be pretty consistent over the course of the hopefully 30-90 shots per mag that would probably take you a bit to finish, which would then bring you to change to a fresh mag. I don't play when it's cold because I'm a wimp, but that doesn't sound like a massive issue with black gas as long as you purge your mags before you get in your car.
The main place we get all this length from is the cylinder, so if we did go gas we could easily ditch 6-8 inches and more importantly, MAKE THE GUN LESS FAT. My one biggest gripe with the VSR, it's stupid barrel and receiver.

If we were able to use a standard VSR cylinder which is perfectly good for this, that would be great as it looks like it would be just dandy. No need to change that, unless we wanted a proprietary thing that was pretty close to the same in function.

I guess if it's possible to make it look cool, do so, but it's not the biggest deal as it seems like even the Tomahawk is sort of selling, but looks do help a gun, or anything really.
 
#79 ·
Looks do help a gun sell but function also does. And once people try a small light gun like the above pics, there will be a stack of great reviews as it is so light and compact.
The VSR10 has never been the coolest looking gun, in fact, most people would say it looks pretty plain. But it is light and less bulky compared to most other rifles (As well as built strong). And so, it has gained a reputation. Person, I think the VSR is a boring looking gun and I prefer the looks of a lot of other rifles over it. But the other rifles do not compete for usability.

Gas is good too Silicone. But I think manufacturers prefer the spring option as it is cheaper to get into for consumers and so therefore, they sell more. It is also very reliable. The bigger market does seem to be the spring bolt action
 
#80 ·
In terms of looking cool, real steel and gas guns are a lot cooler due to the systems being easier to do in a small area, so that does make sense. I don't think there's avoiding a fat receiver or outer barrel on a springer except the Scout, as it just wouldn't really be easy to get around.

At this point in the hobby for me, performance is kinda hitting a limit, and now I want performance AND looks.
 
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